But you are in the Netherlands - is there panic buying there ?

Quote from: Raider4 on 26 September 2021, 06:55:00 PM
No one's panic buying, they're all just being sensible and prudent . . .

Not all of them..

I am being sensible and prudent.
The others are panic buying.
The ones ahead of me in the queue are causing a crisis.

Quote from: Lord Kermit of Birkenhead on 27 September 2021, 10:43:06 AM
But you are in the Netherlands - is there panic buying there ?

Don't be silly, we're still in the EU with the right to freedom of movement. My downstairs neighbours are Bulgarians, on the next street live Austrians and Hungarians. Round the corner are Poles and the next corner are some Germans. Then scattered amongst the rest of us are the Surinamese, Indonesians (as a result of Dutch Empire), and the Eritreans, Syrians etc. because the Dutch don't regard asylum seekers as some kind of virus. Furthermore there is a love of HGVs in the Netherlands, so there appear to be plenty of things being hauled by lorries, plus the superb rail network and the huge canal and river network across Europe moving goods here and there. It would appear the news media are not keeping you informed that you are the only country experiencing such a crisis. That would be an admission that the Brexit experiment is not working.

They had the Lithuanian haulier chap on the radio again this morning and they are still experiencing HGV driver shortages in the EU. No problems with fuel though!

Quote from: Leman on 27 September 2021, 10:19:02 AM
I've bought an electric car.

I was thinking of that - especially now our barking mad Mayor (Mad Marvin) is thinking of introducing a low emissions zone in Central Bristol & our little A2 wont comply. Said 'zone' would starts at the bottom of our road (but doesn't include ours - so we are not exempt) - but means that if we want to leave the road to go anywhere sensible (shops or just out of Bristol) we will have to enter the zone & either comply or pay each time!!!

However, as there is only on-road parking where I live, the charging of said electric car is going to be very tricky - as you can never guarantee to park outside your own house.
The bloke next door however - who has bought an electric car in advance of the new zone coming into force - has also installed a fantastic gadget - a bit like those large gantry type overhead swivel hoses, the sort of thing you see on oil rigs and fuel tankers. So he can park his car up to 4 doors away from his house and run a charging cable over the pavement above car and head-height out to his car to charge it. I am just waiting for this year crop of students to fix their eyes on this and either try and swing on it or cut it (for drunken amusement); or one day he'll forget and park it on the opposite side of the road and the bin lorry will carry it off as it gets tangled in it.

Like all such things - there is no joined up thinking in things these days.

Interesting interview on the Radio 4 late this afternoon about the dangers of electric scooters - some poor woman who got hit by one and suffered horrific injuries.

I nearly ran into one of the blighters going the wrong way up a one way street in the dark, with no lights on. As I swerved to miss it, and beeped my horn, his passenger stuck 2 fingers up at me.
Surely there must be some Darwinian theory about the combination of 'fresher students' (you can tell I live in a city with 2 universities) and electric scooters.
I could have wiped out at least half-a dozen new freshers in the last week - usually mindlessly lost in their headphones, looking intently at their mobile phones, whilst crossing busy road junctions without looking.

I live in a cul-de-sac (mid-terrace villa) where some houses have their own driveways and some park their cars where they can (like me). There is not enough space for all the cars owned by people who live in the street to park at the same time.

Installing my own electric car charge station would be pointless as I couldn't guarantee being able to park within reach of it unless I converted my front garden into a private driveway. My car would then be right outside my living room window. I don't think the city council would allow that.

Plan B

My youngest daughter lives just 15 minutes up the road and she has a private driveway at the side of her semi-detached house. We could install an electric car charge station there as there is room for two cars. Arranging a time for access would be a doddle.

Now, all I need is an electric car that I can afford and which will allow me to drive 4 hours to York and another 4 hours to Edinburgh the same day without a top up charge. I'll probably die first.

Radio 4 is running a 3 part (I think) look into the current situation of being able to drive around and charge electric cars. To pick my daughter up from Edinburgh it would not be possible currently, without a significant increase in journey time and assuming I could find a space to charge en route. Then where she lives in a flat with no access to the road, simply impossible to charge.

Where I used to work we did some work for a couple of companies like Ecotricity for charging stations on forecourts. IIRC the cost and time roll out across the whole country was eye watering expensive and time consuming.  Even where we live we'd have to park in the back lane and run a cable from the garage, once we'd had a charging point installed. So at present a completely unviable situation IMHO .

Until the problem of driving 300 miles --> 10 minute "re-charge" --> drive another 300 miles is solved can't see them being viable.

Always wondered why they don't make the support cars in in road cycling (i.e. Tour de France) electric. Limited (and known) daily mileage, usually < 250km. Would be a great advert for them.

Or the support/camera bikes in road races. Can't be much fun for the runners, breathing in those petrol fumes.

Quote from: Raider4 on 27 September 2021, 08:16:31 PM
Until the problem of driving 300 miles --> 10 minute "re-charge" --> drive another 300 miles is solved can't see them being viable.

Always wondered why they don't make the support cars in in road cycling (i.e. Tour de France) electric. Limited (and known) daily mileage, usually < 250km. Would be a great advert for them.

Or the support/camera bikes in road races. Can't be much fun for the runners, breathing in those petrol fumes.

The team cars are nearly all nearly all Skoda Octavia, which are available in electric.
I wonder whether it's simple inertia (We'll get around to it soon), or the difficulty of locating 120 charging points in some of the start/finish towns

A miniscule start, but the "Derny" (Lead moped used in Keirin races and some endurance time trials) is now electric.

Quote from: Leman on 27 September 2021, 10:19:02 AM
I've bought an electric car.

On the assumption that it is the-real-deal rather than a radio-control car it would be very interesting to know how you view recharging and range.  As already expressed, current models have long recharge times and limited range.  It is a lot of money to invest and one really wants to be sure it will deliver the needed performance.

Sometime... even with electric, we are going to HAVE to 'go back' to 19c settlement, transport network along with nationalised utilities...  and integrated Central planning for any 'development' of housing or retail/manufacture.
'Resources' WILL become shorter for increasing population.
Just CANNOT work, otherwise

Quote from: Heedless Horseman on 28 September 2021, 05:41:02 AM
Sometime... even with electric, we are going to HAVE to 'go back' to 19c settlement, transport network along with nationalised utilities...  and integrated Central planning for any 'development' of housing or retail/manufacture.
'Resources' WILL become shorter for increasing population.
Just CANNOT work, otherwise

Anyone wanting more details on this, follow Tim Watkins' blog Consciousness of Sheep:
https://consciousnessofsheep.co.uk/

You'll find it is mathematically impossible to replace all 1.4 billion fossil fuel cars on the planet 1 for 1 with electric ones. Just to do all the UK's cars would take up planetary resources for a few years of certain metals. This is before we even get to the predicament of being able to run them all simultaneously.

IIRC there is not enough of one of the crucial metals used for batteries to make them just for cars, talk of other uses for batteries.

I can 'sort of ' see' 'Horse' coming back. But with the huge population growth since the 40s and much of the grazing/ hay fodder, now 'Housing'...
Oh Well...  I probably won't be around.. so let 'Them' get by...

Quote from: sultanbev on 28 September 2021, 08:34:46 AM
Anyone wanting more details on this, follow Tim Watkins' blog Consciousness of Sheep:
https://consciousnessofsheep.co.uk/

You'll find it is mathematically impossible to replace all 1.4 billion fossil fuel cars on the planet 1 for 1 with electric ones. Just to do all the UK's cars would take up planetary resources for a few years of certain metals. This is before we even get to the predicament of being able to run them all simultaneously.

Public transport!

Nowt wrong wit trains - commuyin to Ormskirk termarrw

Quote from: flamingpig0 on 28 September 2021, 11:36:45 AM
Public transport!

Yes... but need to reactivate all the 19c railway network... and supply power... unless we go back to 'Steam'... 
Have read that Dutch run their rail by  windmill generated elecctric.
For MYSELF.. I Hate the sight of Wind Turbines... but... 

We need to start by not transporting stuff hundreds of miles, when it can be sourced locally.  Insisting on only selling electric cars in 2030 is ludicrous, when every supermarket is flying in fresh produce from all over the world.

We need to buy local and buy in season produce. It would then be less need to wrap everything in plastic.

Years ag when I used to help out a charity in Norfolk, I went to buy a several boxes of mushrooms for the charity catering from the local farm shop.   The local fam had a sign up saying "Local mushrooms", but they were in a box marked with a London address.  I asked the farmers wife about this, and she said "We have a very good deal that means we have to sell all our crop to a particular wholesaler. They collect the mushrooms and take them to London to be packed in their own boxes. We tell them how many we want back and they send them back on the lorry that comes to collect the next load. We are not allowed under the terms of the contract to sell our own mushrooms direct. "

She agreed it was mad but the price they got meant that they could not afford to do otherwise.

Love it when people shout use public transport
I am a decorator and the bus driver would not be amused when i turn up with a 3m+ ladder, at least 1 pair of steps, 2-3 tins of paint and a tool box at least.
Then ask for a return to some small village in Northumberland.
Its always seemed nice to go to work in the same place at the same times every day for ever!
And i am not alone.
Can electric cars tow?