QuoteAnd he will most certainly tell you he "got bored of it" and go back to TV or computer games. As a caring parent you will attempt it again until you realise it is not much use. I read that after every christmas on ebay.
The attention span of their average customer is simply too short to have any impact on wargaming.

You are missing the point. It isn't about wargaming its about giving my kids something they may find interesting. If they do great if they don't fine its exactly the same as action man, Barbie, playstation games. They will move on. GW know this and know they have to refresh their product constantly. They don't give a sh*t about Pendraken or any other wargame model manufacturer. They aren't competing with them or in the same market they are more concerned with little johnnys mother spending money on space marines rather than the next Gears of War game, 1809 Bavarians ain't on the radar.
I buy Pendraken not GW because I'm more into historicals. But when my son's older if he may want space marines, I'll buy some and paint them. If he's stays interested I'll see if he wants onto historicals.

I am inclined to say you are missing the point where you cannot spend money on GW Space Marines AND the Barbie doll. You can only buy one. So GW IS competing for your money with a lot of other sellers in and outside wargaming. New tyres or a box of Marines?

The problem for GW -and they actually admit it- is that the Videogame of Space Marine is offering what people nowadays call "instant gratification" whereas the box of ten Marines needs to be built and painted.

"Work" or instant "fun" what do you think an undeveloped mind will chose. The figures on this matter speak for themselves.

I totally agree with you that the box of Marines is the better choice from the parental point of view. (In lieu of Pendraken figures which would be even better). My little one (female, 7) was totally in love with GW 40K Eldar and I had to buy her Guardians and a Jetbike dude. She now prefers building a castle and playing with Knight's. She totally loves her D&D Half Elf and Bowman I painted for her. "Moving on" is an issue for the hobby as such. Every youngster that leaves gaming for another hobby reduces the number of players.

I am not sure about you and others and yes some people should not have the same hobby as we do but without "fresh blood" our hobby will eventually die. This cannot be what we want, right? And the "come in, don't even dare to think other than we tell you,  spend your money and then leave fast" approach is in my eyes ill advised for increasing the playerbase.

Don't care. i have purchased GW stuff for my son and he then moved on to Urban War and then Warmachine. He has never really been into historical gaming. I have never ever purchased any GW stuff for myself (Except Historical rules and lists) and probably never will.  So they can charge what they want. If people continue to buy from them then. . . . Enjoy!
I just don't care !

Quote from: Fenton on 06 October 2013, 08:26:54 PM
I dont think GW actually think of themselves of belonging to the wargaming community...I think they consider themselves part of the GW community

Quite right in my opinion.  When I worked there many, many years ago we had to tell people it was a hobby not a game.

Quote from: howayman on 07 October 2013, 07:15:42 PM
Don't care. i have purchased GW stuff for my son and he then moved on to Urban War and then Warmachine. He has never really been into historical gaming. I have never ever purchased any GW stuff for myself (Except Historical rules and lists) and probably never will.  So they can charge what they want. If people continue to buy from them then. . . . Enjoy!
I just don't care !

Buying GW stuff is not wrong per se. (Okay let's say it is debatable - lol)

Their approach to business simply disgusts some people.
But complaining endlessly and still buying their stuff is somewhat pointless.

Me and my son play older editions of both WFB, and 40k, but we never buy directly from GW, its always by trading and buying 2nd hand or such like. That way we don't get all the faff of the "keeping up with the jones-syndrome, which is  their hook, and this way we aint putting money into GWs pockets (since they have already been paid for and flogged on dirt cheap  )

Also in the age of the web, we can get access to much better proxy figures from other manufacturers, and get a better bargain too.

Even so my kids want to go to their store (which is where they'll get reeled in) I've banned them to be honest. Hopefully I've learned them enough about other wargaming and miniatures options out there, to make more informed judgements about flushing their spends on finecrap and overpriced modelling materials in favour of getting a lot more from the hobby.

I think as a parent, the strategy of GW now is it lures kids in, and to feed their fix for new stuff they know parents are going to end up paying out for.
My son likes playing WFB, but is just as happy playing even historical games as well, so at least he knows that lots of other stuff is available outside of that.

I can understand GW protecting their logo's and trademarks, that bit's fine.  But to try and stop a third party website from showing pictures of models which they have painted themselves is ridiculous.  How is that any different from someone with a blog building the latest batch of 'Space Marines (TM)' and posting a review with some pics?  Or simply showing off their models, which they've spent money and time assembling.  I can't see how any court in the world would uphold something like that. 

They might as well put a poster in every GW shop saying 'Spend your money, buy our stuff, but show it off online, and you'll be hearing from our lawyers.'

I have fought GW twice in the past... and won.

Their bullying tactics crumble when stood up against, because (despite their team of amazingly competent lawyers) a lot of the time they hope (and succeed) their scare tactics will make them get their own way. They back down when they aren`t sure they can win; and to be honest, its not worth it to them to pursue the small fry. But I reiterate, most people crumble when presented with a legal document and comply to their wishes.

... this I will NEVER do, as I never step outside the law against them.

Yes, I am disgusted by GW, sorry.


Six 

Quote from: Leon on 08 October 2013, 03:25:42 AM
I can understand GW protecting their logo's and trademarks, that bit's fine.  But to try and stop a third party website from showing pictures of models which they have painted themselves is ridiculous.  How is that any different from someone with a blog building the latest batch of 'Space Marines (TM)' and posting a review with some pics?  Or simply showing off their models, which they've spent money and time assembling.  I can't see how any court in the world would uphold something like that. 

They might as well put a poster in every GW shop saying 'Spend your money, buy our stuff, but show it off online, and you'll be hearing from our lawyers.'

I think it is only because they did it before the models were actually officially released

But how can you expect in the age of the internet to keep back information?

GW will not be able to surpress what is in development. They can only shorten the notification to (currently) about a month.

And there is my problem with it. I DO spend my budget on minis (if I have one) but if they do not tell me when my army gets a new release (a one year overview would be enough for most people)
then I will spend my money where my business is valued. Contrary to GWs belief there is competition for my money and, sorry, they fail. Now the fanboys will argue my money is not important to them but more and more people think the same.

Is it also not important when a whole club declares the local GW pushers as persona non grata? I know a few places where local gamers told GW to shove it. Preferably sideways. I know of annually more than 30K in wargaming budgets being allocated to other companies..... put it ona  global scale and my "15 % price rise =/= 1 % rise in turnover" starts to make sense.

You know, all this method of distancing themselves from everything else wargames related is probably just so that the GW fanboys don't accidentally get to see other firms stuff!

I expect they'd rather control every aspect of the whole "hobby" experience by putting blinkers on them as much as possible.

Myself, I don't give a flying crap about anything they make or bring out these days, but it does pee me off when I regularly hear about GW throwing their weight around, they just make me want to rant on like a militant anti-GW-ite (or whatever) and makes me hate what they are a little more each time.

For a gaming company, GW are really bad killjoys!

sooooo,

I wonder who's brave enough now to tell anyone here they`ve just gone and bought a brand new GW army for their games  

hehe


okay, that was low of me   

I've just bought a new GW army ....

Well new to me ...

From EBay ....

For considerably less than GW wanted for it new ....

Before they canned the range ...

And system .....

I like my new Warmaster Undead though :-)

*points at Ithoriel in horror... teeth pulled back in sheer revulsion and terror at the beast before him*

Actually, I have a ton of WG stuff... mostly from the late 80`s and early 90`s. And I bought Battle Of Five Armies, Space Hulk and several bits and bobs for Warmaster (which I never play)  I`d even buy their Purity Seal, except they refuse to ship to Ireland.


Brave man Ithoriel      



Six

Quote from: Ithoriel on 08 October 2013, 03:39:18 PM
I've just bought a new GW army ....

Well new to me ...

From EBay ....

For considerably less than GW wanted for it new ....

Before they canned the range ...

And system .....

I like my new Warmaster Undead though :-)

Me too, except it was empire and probably at half the price for vaguely equivalent  models from Pendraken , which is probaly a quarter of the GW  price, if you could still buy the stuff from them