Paul, the hex is such a defined shape / pattern, that I agree, it is hard to dress is up to naturalise it and in particular to break up the outlines of the hex. But I would like to try some improvements to my layout. The square with just 4 corners does make it easier to accommodate a unit and a building in the same location, the sided hex makes that a tad harder. The downside with the square is that terrain in general conforms to two axis, though hexes only slightly improve on that artificial look and in fact can't handle crossroads and bridges as well as the square does. 

Because I do a lot of boardgaming, which can use complicated rules and of course hexes, i sometimes think it is best to have that as my hex fix just like to use my figures for a more aesthetic, relaxed, fun type of play and that would mean an open board for me for a bit of Old School :-)

Hi Norm

I forgot to mention that I was really struck by your earlier photo of McPhersons Ridge and how similar it looked to what you see on screen when playing one of John Tillers computer 'Battleground' games (hopefully I will not be put in the glasshouse for mentioning computer wargames on this forum) which also uses hexes and you can you can set it so that you do not actually see the hex sides. Are you familiar with them?

Link: http://www.matrixgames.com/products/product.asp?gid=319

Cheers Paul

Paul, I did use some very early battleground stuff and the computer seems ideally suited as an antidote to having to collect, paint and store figures and armies and keeping this set up over several days (weeks!) and remembering rules :-)

I tend to stay away from computer games in general, for no other reason than I quickly fall to repetative strain pain, boo - hiss!   But then I paint insread!!!!!

I recall a discussion on grids on a different forum.

Discussion quickly identified three different approaches.

1. Multiple units may be located/stacked in one grid cell: Avalon Hill, Square Bashing, Backgammon.
2. One unit per cell: Battle Cry and the Command and Colours franchise, Chess, Draughts, Ludo.
3. One unit (or its components) can spread across several cells: Perry's travel battle (I think), Battleship.

In the first case the cell represents a significant area, and the rules are vague about precise positioning of the units within.
This seems to work well for very large scale battles, and eras where combined arms operations were planned and executed.

I've rather less experience of actual wargames that use the 2nd and 3rd approach, but get the impression that they represent progressively smaller cell areas, with more emphasis on precise locations of units.

old topic but what the hey....

I am investing a lot of time into gridded wargaming currently with several cloths bought (yeah I know lazy....) and trying out of several rulesets for the ultimate 'Dark Age' feel....even written my own set

Fraid grids just dont grap me....

Quote from: Macsen Wledig on 26 July 2021, 10:49:56 AM
old topic but what the hey....

I am investing a lot of time into gridded wargaming currently with several cloths bought (yeah I know lazy....) and trying out of several rulesets for the ultimate 'Dark Age' feel....even written my own set

I'm a fan of gridded games (and for that matter non-gridded ones!) our group really likes Rommel and For King and Parliament, we quite like To the Strongest, but just haven't played it that much. We did toy with a home brew gridded set, but found it didn't quite work - ranges and LoS were awkward once over a couple of boxes. But then we used some of the gridded ideas to help with the non-gridded version - principally defining the centre of formations, rather than worrying about individual models.

its not everyone's cup of tea and I for one am not going to ram it down other's throats 

as I get older I am less able to handle complex numbers, complex rules and movement vagaries. The other thing is I am now heavily (and I mean heavily) into 10mm so feel that I want something that is pleasing to play and not overburden my old brain PLUS I can potentially use whatever base size and depth I like since I mainly play solo

Hi Macsen, thaanks for waking this thread up

Since this thread started 3 years ago, I don't think much has appreciably changed (Surprisingly to me). A raft of rule writers did not follow the 'To the Strongest' trend, but neither has the hex / square lost ground. Peter Pig are still supporting the square and Battlescale have started producing some nice 80mm resin tiles. To the strongest remain very popular.

But I note that the revised La Salle rules did not pick up a square habit, so author Sam did not think the merits of his Rommel would have enhanced the napoleonic game (which saw some quite big changes) and I can't think of another commercial set that adopted the grid since.

I still do a lot of boardgaming and at the moment I am after the figures side of my hobby providing a more old school visual approach as the counter-balance to the regularity of the grid - however, having said that, I am just waiting for the sun to go off the sun lounge, so I can get a game set up in there for a game and it will be on Kallistra hexes.

truly woken up....

I am looking at what rulesets/how easily can be converted to grid use. Of the ones I have scanned, Age of Hannibal by LWTV seems the most straight forward

There's an early version of the portable wargame for ancients available at http://www.users.dircon.co.uk/~warden/BlogFreeDownloads/FreePWAncients.pdf. Might be worth looking at?

thanks, appreciated

Do you have aa favoured period?

Hi Norm (and rest),

Thanks for the thread. Time ago I read it and arouse my interest in wargames with grids, so I read some rules and played Battlecry, Memoir 44, C&C Ancients and Strategos/Lost Battles.

Reading again this has renewed my interest. I feel they can be faster than traditional sets with rulers, and that would be great for me. Also, thinking about Strategos, it gives big battle commander point of view which focus on big areas so you don't need to manage exact positioning of every unit.

Apart from TTS and H&H does anybody know if there are any similar ruleset set in the Middle Ages?

Quote from: Macsen Wledig on 26 July 2021, 10:49:56 AM
old topic but what the hey....

I am investing a lot of time into gridded wargaming currently with several cloths bought (yeah I know lazy....) and trying out of several rulesets for the ultimate 'Dark Age' feel....even written my own set

http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=19731.0
This may, or may not, be of interest.

Quote from: Edmund2011 on 26 July 2021, 10:38:52 PM
Hi Norm (and rest),

Thanks for the thread. Time ago I read it and arouse my interest in wargames with grids, so I read some rules and played Battlecry, Memoir 44, C&C Ancients and Strategos/Lost Battles.

Reading again this has renewed my interest. I feel they can be faster than traditional sets with rulers, and that would be great for me. Also, thinking about Strategos, it gives big battle commander point of view which focus on big areas so you don't need to manage exact positioning of every unit.

Apart from TTS and H&H does anybody know if there are any similar ruleset set in the Middle Ages?

C&C now has a Medieval module. I am not aware of any medieval figure specific rules that are designed for grids other than the ones put out by Kallistra. It might be worth scanning through the back catalogue a Second Chance Games for a true boardgame system that covers the medieval system and then taking that to your figure games.

Quote from: Norm on 26 July 2021, 02:25:10 PM
Hi Macsen, thaanks for waking this thread up

Since this thread started 3 years ago, I don't think much has appreciably changed (Surprisingly to me). A raft of rule writers did not follow the 'To the Strongest' trend, but neither has the hex / square lost ground. Peter Pig are still supporting the square and Battlescale have started producing some nice 80mm resin tiles. To the strongest remain very popular.

But I note that the revised La Salle rules did not pick up a square habit, so author Sam did not think the merits of his Rommel would have enhanced the napoleonic game (which saw some quite big changes) and I can't think of another commercial set that adopted the grid since.

I still do a lot of boardgaming and at the moment I am after the figures side of my hobby providing a more old school visual approach as the counter-balance to the regularity of the grid - however, having said that, I am just waiting for the sun to go off the sun lounge, so I can get a game set up in there for a game and it will be on Kallistra hexes.

The little set of grid rules that I regularly examine has shown little movement.

Strategos:
Isn't going anywhere.
Though I admire the concept, I find the writing and gameplay impenetrable.

Peter Pig:
My first exposure to grid wargames, and still a big supporter.
I find the writing is idiosyncratic almost to the point of off-putting.
Also rather fussy about issues that ought to disappear when using grids (Grid size and unit composition).

To The Strongest / King and Parliament:
Extremely well written and presented, proving that grid does not equal a reading challenge.
To the Strongest seems to be suffering the fate of many competition ancients sets - constant modification.
This has turned a rather easy read into a challenge of referencing and indexing.
It remains to be seen whether version 2 can resolve the pile of updates into something as elegant as version 1.

For C19 and Napoleonics, "Bloody Big BATTLES!" works well on a grid. Since movement and firing are all calculated in 3" increments, it translates readily to 3" squares or hexes. I've seen both applied since lockdown forced us all to try remote gaming (grids are helpful for that too).

Chris

Bloody Big BATTLES!
https://groups.io/g/bloodybigbattles
BBBBlog:
http://bloodybigbattles.blogspot.com/
BBB on FB:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1412549408869331

Quote from: hammurabi70 on 27 July 2021, 12:09:20 AM
http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=19731.0
This may, or may not, be of interest.

thanks 

I think grids are great. They certainly help get most of the rainwater off the streets.