Prestonpans 1745

[pierre the shy]

This week I put together some card bases using MS paint and figures from the Junior General site that didn't come out too badly for a test run of the V&B Jacobite wing scale rules.

I chose Prestonpans as both Falkirk and Colloden have a lot more units involved.

Last night we fought two games - the first one, using the historical deployment was pretty much a re-run of the actual battle with the Highland infantry sweeping over the Government forces like a tsunami (sorry Paul  )

After a cuppa and Easter eggs    to restore the ol' sugar levels we played another game using free deployment which worked a lot better for the Government forces. The dragoons just kept on having a bad day  but the infantry, having stationary bonus's, came within 1 point of breaking at least one of the Highland commands.   

Overall the system worked well, and with better and more variety of troops becoming available after Prestonpans on both sides it appears that I/we will be pursuing this project further and committing to figures rather than card bases (though i have some other things to do first). 

[FierceKitty]

Dragoons are human sacrifices, aren't they? Always get wiped out after bravely securing an advanced position which turns out to have no effect on the battle, or trying to nibble a bit at the enemy flank (and losing more than they inflict).

[paulr]

The first game was not a lot of fun

The second was more interesting but having to charge with Dragoons that stood a 50% chance of routing before contact was "interesting" to say the least

Definitely a period that shows promise and plays differently than Napoleonics or AWI using Volley & Bayonet

The highlight of the evening was watching the three Jacobite commanders, who all have Scottish heritage, arguing before the game had even begun

[Duke Speedy of Leighton]

Sounds a lot of fun!

[Ithoriel]

The highlight of the evening was watching the three Jacobite commanders, who all have Scottish heritage, arguing before the game had even begun

That's taking historical accuracy a little far!

Glad the games went well, even if pre-battle planning may not have!

[pierre the shy]

After our Prestonpans games a couple of weeks ago we had a bit of chat and decided to try a second scenario with better Government Infantry to see if they can handle the "highland charge".

So tonight its off to Falkirk to see what happens - historically it was fought late in the afternoon in the middle of a rainstorm which greatly aided the Jacobite attack.

For our game its been agreed that the weather will be fine (though conversely its actually raining steadily here in Welliington today for the first time in weeks  ) and we are using the historic setup.

I have the Government artillery stands if they are required as well 

Going to be a webel and take command of the Jacobite second line as my family are connected to the Gordons and Ogilvies who had a brigade present at Falkirk   

Hope Roy's got some good single malt hidden away somewhere - might need one (or two....) 

[d_Guy]

Will be interested to hear (and if possible?) see the results! Good luck!
When you consider that the government forces almost broke the highland charge at Killiecrankie with fire power, the odds may be against you at Falkirk. Particularly without the element of surprise (as at Prestonpans) or the rain to diminish the Government 2nd and following volleys.
Was it before or after Falkirk that the government changed thier bayonet doctrine to lunging to protect the man on left? If after - if you close - you win!  An Gordanach!

[d_Guy]

Sorry, protecting the man on the right!   

[Leman]

Have you seen the old 1960s BBC production of Culloden? It was done as if a TV crew and reporters were at the scene. I always remember the reporter saying, "This is grapeshot; and this is what it does." It also showed the British infantry protecting the man on the right.

[Hwiccee]

The change in bayonet drill is usually attribute to Cumberland and so it would be after Falkirk. But Duffy in his new book says there is no evidence that Cumberland actually changed anything with the drill. So either they never did the 'protect the man on the right' ting or they had always done this, he doesn't know. The key thing was Cumberland got the men to stand and use whatever drill they used, rather than just run.

[Leman]

I got the impression it was because the charging highlanders' left sides were partially protected by the targe, but the right was vulnerable with the arm raised holding the sword.

[Hwiccee]

Yes that was certainly the theory and presumably it would work. But Duffy says it was either used or not used at ALL the battles and not just Culloden. Duffy points to the redcoats standing firm and the highlanders throwing away their targes to being important at Culloden. Duffy's new 'Fight for the Throne' book is very good.

[cameronian]

I'm with Duffy, I never really bought the 'ignore the hairy arsed highlander to your front, expose your left and thrust to your right' myth, not credible, more an afterthought to 'big up' a victory over a half starved, undermanned, exhausted, demoralised enemy, attacking over too big a distance, over rough ground, in the face of volley fire and canister. Where the distance was shorter they charged home and broke the line ... unfortunately there was a second line.

[Leman]

Yes your probably right. Had I been a lowland Scot I'd have gone for the hairy arsed, uncivilised northerner to my front, especially if he was daft enough to chuck his targe away.

[FierceKitty]

Yes that was certainly the theory and presumably it would work. But Duffy says it was either used or not used at ALL the battles and not just Culloden. Duffy points to the redcoats standing firm and the highlanders throwing away their targes to being important at Culloden. Duffy's new 'Fight for the Throne' book is very good.

Everything Duffy writes is good, I find.

[Westmarcher]

Why did they throw their targes away? Did they have more muskets than popular myth / history would lead us to believe?

I cannot remember the source - it may even have been me who quoted it in another thread (from The Last Highlander - about Lord Lovat?) - but I'm sure there was something somewhere about so many thousand muskets (more than the whole Jacobite Army) being found by Govt. troops immediately after and in the subsequent months after Culloden.   

[Hwiccee]

The targes were heavy so they were usually left on carts until just before the battle and then taken up. But at Culloden they did a night march and left the baggage behind. So 2 sources mention that most had been ditched by the time of the battle.

Duffy says muskets were short at first and on the march into England. But by the time they got back to Scotland most/all would have them.

[d_Guy]

Have you seen the old 1960s BBC production of Culloden? It was done as if a TV crew and reporters were at the scene. I always remember the reporter saying, "This is grapeshot; and this is what it does." It also showed the British infantry protecting the man on the right.

Yes! And remember it vividly - need to see if I can find on YouTube. The change in bayonet thrust was described in detail so that is my impression I'm sure. I believe that BBC production was based on Prebble's book of the same name but in a quick review did not find it specifically addressed (although the discription of Barrell's foot have every bayonet bloody and bent)

An inventory of weapons captured (not clear that all were from the field) - E. Andrew Mobrays edited and annotated edition of Lord Archibald Cabell's Scottish Swords...at Culloden - has 2320 muskets and 190 broadswords (for which Cumberland had offered a one shilling bounty)
Puzzling numbers.

Blackmore's Destructive and Formidable does offer not only the firing pattern used but specific use of the bayonet ordered by Cumberland which involved changing from a right facing trust to a left facing thrust (to the front however) to take the unprotected side of the opponent.
Cumberland heavily drilled his men and is no doubt responsible for instilling the neccessary discipline against a highland charge.

Personally I would have (as a song about Prestonpans relates) filled my breeks and run all the way to Aberdeen!

[d_Guy]

Incidently I have not spread Duffy's book - sounds like it is recommended?
Should I live long enough I may get to the '45 for wargaming - but after FPW - which I just started!

[Hwiccee]

d_Guy,


This is the Duffy book - http://www.amazon.com/Fight-Throne-Jacobite-45-Reconsidered/dp/1910777056/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1459607765&sr=1-1&keywords=fight+for+the+throne

I am sure others will also sell it. I am also sure many, including myself, would agree with FierceKitty that pretty much everything by Duffy is good. Some of it now is getting a little dated but the above book is a few months old.

I am afraid I am not a fan of Blackmore's Destructive and Formidable and I would be wary of relying on it. Duffy says the Government troops abandoned platoon firing at Falkirk and switched to rank firing or volleys. I don't know about this against the highlanders but that makes sense based on similar examples. As you say Cumberland drilled his men hard and this did the trick.