Question for Crusades gamers

[FierceKitty]

Granted that all authories medieval and modern agree that the charge of Frankish cavalry is an irresistable force on a contemporary battlefield, what tactic do you find most effective in handling it? And why choose that one rather than another?
I put the question to afficionadi of Roman as well as Muslim armies.

[Matt J]

I think the Romans when encountering heavy Sarmation or Alan cavalry deployed deep (7 ranks I think) and dense. The first rank (heavily armoured) took the hit. The rear ranks deluged the horsemen with missiles.

[FierceKitty]

I meant e. Roman, as in Manuel or Diogenes Romanus.

[DanJ]

As with all things wargaming a lot depends on the rules being used, what they allow/encourage and how they model the different armies of the crusader period.

The Crusades (up to the fourth) are my favourite period and IMHO the most interesting conflict of the middle ages, pitting different cultures with different military doctrines against each other against a background of idealism and fanaticism.

In general the crusader knights had an advantage in ferocity (the power of their charge) which was probably more social and training based rather than a technical edge like couched lances.  However they were generally short on numbers and rules/lists should relfect that.

In terms of tactics:-

1) Wear them down and disorganise them with skirmishers and missiles, especially light cavalry.

2) Try not to meet them head on with cavalry except for later Mamaluk Ghulams which should be their equal.

3) Once the knights have charged, counter attack before they can re-organise

4) Use large blocks of infantry to soak up the Crusaders charge and provide a basis from which Saracen cavalry can counter charge.

5) Trust in the One True God!

[toxicpixie]

Didn't the Muslims/Arabs very rapidly coin the phrase "cautious as a Frank"? I suspect when you've nothing to lose and everything to gain a mad pelt in seems an attractive option, but when you might lose your shiny new stuff it becomes a lot less enticing...

[FierceKitty]

I suspect my table, while large, is not large enough to allow the prolonged evasion and trickling casualties that a Turkic commander dreams of causing.

[Duke Speedy of Leighton]

Wait for heat, weather and diseases to do the work for you?

[cameronian]

But not everbody lives in Margate 

[DanJ]

I suspect my table, while large, is not large enough to allow the prolonged evasion and trickling casualties that a Turkic commander dreams of causing.

Are you mainly considering the First Crusade here?

[Lord Kermit of Birkenhead]

But not everbody lives in Margate 

Nobody under 90 lives in Margate....

IanS

[FierceKitty]

Are you mainly considering the First Crusade here?

I play around the third. Want to use the Orders too, and who can resist Saleh ad Dinn?

[DanJ]

who can resist Saleh ad Dinn?

Not even Legolas!

FK, have you been following the Cresent and Cross bit on the what's hot thread? I can recomend the rules for Crusade games.

[FierceKitty]

I tend to skip the posts about rule sets. Good, are they?

[DanJ]

Yes they are, very period specific, the core mechanism, the battle boards mean that the different factions use different doctrines and aproach each battle trying to expoit different strengths and abilities.

Page 4 on the 'What's Hot' thread has just about everything you might want to know.