Undercoating without spraying

Started by Last Hussar, 08 July 2023, 11:24:46 PM

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FierceKitty

Quote from: Last Hussar on 09 July 2023, 10:44:42 PMI am now in a 2nd floor flat, and the only downside (apart from distance to my Regular, and lurching back up the stairs after closing time....)

Omission corrected.
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DecemDave

FWIW
Having tried various methods over the years, I seem to have settled on Krylon spray (grey) for soft 1/72 plastics because it creates a surface less prone to flaking but brushed on Liquitex Gesso for 10mm metals. This last was a tip from another forumite (Thanks!) as it shrinks into the figure.  Black with grey drybrush after helps to create black lines and hide anything you miss but I use white for horses (then wash/ink over for fast results).

I am also impressed with speed/contrast paints for 1/72.  Not tried them on 10mm yet.  Have finally disciplined myself to paint one project at a time.  Not sure how well they would work over black in 10mm because they can pool blackish anyway. But the good news is that I no longer feel the need to brush on that AP "tone" crap quickshade which highlights the detail but makes everything look muddy.

I also live in 2nd floor flat but have the luxury of a balcony for spraying .  And a lift for lurching.

DHautpol

Years ago I tried the GW Black but found it too smooth, such that it felt that you were dragging the paint about the surface rather than having settle where the brush had passed.

I have for many years, used Liquitex Black Gesso under GW paints.  As mentioned the gesso shrinks on to the figures, so even relatively thick applications dry very tightly with the detail clearly visible.  It sometimes shrinks away in places but these can be touched in easily.

It also has "tooth" which means that although it appears to have dried to a very smooth finish, it actually has an invisible roughness which allows it to grip the paint as you apply it.

Gesso is available from suppliers of artists' materials.  It comes in black, grey and white and is used to prepare canvases.
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John Cook

Quote from: Last Hussar on 09 July 2023, 10:44:42 PMThe reason for not spraying is very mundane.
I am now in a 2nd floor flat, and the only downside (apart from distance to my Regular) is spraying is now difficult.
Aerosol sprays are hit and miss, literally, as they often don't cover fully.  You also can't use them indoors because of the toxic fumes they give-off and that is a real problem for you, living as you do in a flat (every cloud has a silver lining and you don't have a lawn to mow).  In general terms, the main problem is that if you spray too far away with an aerosol the paint dries in flight and you can be left with a grainy effect on the surface.  I had this happen with over 200 SCW figures and spent a very long time soaking them in various different chemicals from meths to white spirit before using cellulose thinners and a metal brush.  Never again.   Aerosols are also not very good environmentally speaking.  So, this is my solution these days.  Thin some ordinary acrylic white paint, Vallejo is fine, about 25% water and apply with a large brush about, a No 8 or larger.  Mine is so old I can't see the size but it is about as big as my thumb (still talking about the brush :D)  It takes no longer than spraying them and can be done indoors as it produces no fumes. This is the primer onto which the undercoat/top coat will key and it also reveals any imperfection missed during prep.   You can then apply an undercoat if you need to, I prefer white as I find black just dulls the top coat, particularly if it is a colour like yellow or red which are pigment-challenged, and I've never seen the point of black anyway.  Usually, though, I just apply a under/top coat of the principal colour at this stage, one coat is usually enough, thinned a little so it fills the nooks and crannies and lets the highlights show through.  Then I'll give the figures a wash of Vallejo sepia, thinned about 50/50.  Then highlight and finally apply a matt varnish, again by brush.  Aerosol varnishes have issues all their own and also can't be applied indoors for exactly the same reason as aerosol paints.  Lately, though, I've been using an airbrush to prime and this might be your solution to spraying indoors.  You can use ordinary Vallejo acrylic Model Colour but you must thin it, about 50/50, as it isn't really intended for airbrushing.  About 30psi seems fine.  Alternatively use Vallejo Model Air which is intended for airbrushing.  Advantages of the airbrush are that it is quick, but mainly, and this is important for you, is that it can be applied indoors as it doesn't produce fumes, it is unaffected by drying in flight issues and you can apply it very accurately.  The only downside I can think of is the initial investment.  Give an airbrush a go - very good on vehicles. 

Corso

After messing up my first few 10mm's with too many layers I prime by brush with whatever the main colour is going to be, I then add a single layer of additional colours, wash and re apply the first layer as a highlight then selectively highlight a few areas

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mmcv

I used black gesso for a while, it works well enough but I do find I use the Vallejo primer paint more now, as I find it a little easier to pick out details afterwards, though fairly small difference between them.

Noktu

I've started to brush on Vallejo Black Surface Primer mixed with Vallejo German Red/Brown Surface primer, so that I get a nice lush dark brown.

Brown is a great medium to work up lighter colours into the mix. And as I use the tried and tested block all colours and wash. It also enhances the dark brown crevices to be a tad more darker, almost black. And gives overall a bit more earthy look.

Orcs

Quote from: Last Hussar on 09 July 2023, 10:44:42 PMThe reason for not spraying is very mundane.
I am now in a 2nd floor flat, and the only downside (apart from distance to my Regular) is spraying is now difficult.

Can I sugest you look into getting an airbrush and a small compressor. You can then use water based paints without any issues. Overspray is virtually non existant. When I had a flat I spray painted in my Kitchen.

You just put a large sheet of card behind  or use three sides of a box to go round them.
A reasonable 2 stage airbrush will allow you to paint the tracks on a 10 mm tank and not get  the paint on the wheels or hull.



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Ben Waterhouse

Quote from: Orcs on 10 July 2023, 09:59:54 PMCan I sugest you look into getting an airbrush and a small compressor. You can then use water based paints without any issues. Overspray is virtually non existant. When I had a flat I spray painted in my Kitchen.

You just put a large sheet of card behind  or use three sides of a box to go round them.
A reasonable 2 stage airbrush will allow you to paint the tracks on a 10 mm tank and not get  the paint on the wheels or hull.





Any advice on a good cheapish airbrush starter set?
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Raider4

QuoteAny advice on a good cheapish airbrush starter set?
This chap tries the cheapest available on Amazon:


You'll also need a compressor though.

Raider4

Alternatively, try a portable one with rechargeable compressor:



Ben Waterhouse

Thanks Raider, food for thought.
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Raider4


QuoteThanks Raider, food for thought.
No problem. The portable one is suddenly looking very appealing . . .

John Cook

Quote from: Ben Waterhouse on 11 July 2023, 08:49:36 AMAny advice on a good cheapish airbrush starter set?

My airbrush is a Badger bought several years ago and still working fine.  There is, honestly, no such thing as a 'good cheapish' airbrush.  You get what you pay for and there are loads out there to chose from.  I'd avoid anything under £50 and look at ones around £100 that include a compressor.  Some do not come with a compressor and that has to be bought separately.  You'll need a cleaning kit too.  Look on line, there are tutorials and reviews.   

Ben Waterhouse

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