Medieval Indian armies in 10mm

[sultanbev]

Just curious, does anyone make 10mm Indians suitable for 12th-13th century period?

Mark

[GrumpyOldMan]

Hello Sultanbev

Nothing specifically made for this. I was working on a fantasy Indian army and I used a lot of proxies.

The Ottoman Sipahis are handy as are the TB Line Islamic and Eastern European heavy cav:-







I must shamefacedly admit I used Newline elephants. Moving right along.... The Ancient Indian archers are still ok for medieval times. Light cav, the Arab could be used if you're looking at a northern army and the Ancient figures might be a bit anachronistic for elsewhere. Lots of other infantry available from the Indian Mutiny, NWF and Sudan ranges. Arab Sudanese Ghulams can stand in for Ghaznavids, swordsmen etc.

Cheers

GrumpyOldMan

[sultanbev]

Thanks for that, I notice there is a recent Osprey Men at arms on Indian medieval armies, and it says volume 1 suggesting more to follow.

It was this video that peaked my interest, looking for opponents to Mongols that could actually beat them:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TK7eU58qQxM

Mark

[Rhys]

I suggested last year that the wider region Islamic hores states) could be covered by a couple of packs of figures on the TB line mix and match tops and horses in this thread
The armour (both horse and man) is generally similar from Egypt to Afganistan from the 13th to 15th centuries with amix of bow, sword and lance arms. The only common item appears to be a round slightly conical shield.

[steve_holmes_11]

Somewhere here (Ahh, found it)  Proxies for Irregular Wars - Indian Ocean

A bunch of proxies for Irregular Wars forces in the Indian Ocean.
Look under "Combined Indian Lists".

This is a bit later than your timeline, and a broader geography.
I hope there's something in there you can find useful.


My main sources for Indian troops were:
 * Ancient Classical Indians: Excellent archers and elephants.
 * Mutineers: Irregular infantry using the ghazis and badmash (The Ghazis have a nice dhal shield).
 * Ottomans: Their Sipahi make a good noble cavalry.
 * TB Line Islamics: Slightly larger in scale and extremely detailed, a good complementary range with excellent horse archers.
 * Don't underestimate the 

You probably have a good idea of the look you want.
Take a look at the other recommended proxies.
You might, for example, feel that a Sassanid style heavy cavalry matches your idea better than Ottomans.

A beauty of 10mm is the ease of "Paint conversion".
Iron armour can be painted as fabric.
A little paint can apply a shirt over a bare chested casting.
A tight shirt can be painted as bare chested.
etc.

I hope this is helpful.

[fsn]

My main sources for Indian troops were:
 * Ancient Classical Indians: Excellent archers and elephants.
 * Mutineers: Irregular infantry using the ghazis and badmash (The Ghazis have a nice dhal shield).
 * Ottomans: Their Sipahi make a good noble cavalry.
 * TB Line Islamics: Slightly larger in scale and extremely detailed, a good complementary range with excellent horse archers.
 * Don't underestimate the

Don't underestimate the what? 

[steve_holmes_11]

Don't underestimate the what? 

Oh, cut off in my prime :-(


What I intended to type was

Don't underestimate the flexibility of very generic light horsemen.
Both the Numidian cavalry and the Mahdist cavalry are great fillers where you need less afluent blokes on horses.

[Rhys]

Just as an idle question, what shape are the shields on TB-189?

[Ithoriel]

Tear-drop shaped, Rhys

[Rhys]

Cheers for that, I was not aware that this picture existed (hang on, just found it at the to left on the relevent page).
So they could possibly be used for Rich Rus, Poles and Lithuanians, but useless for Islamics.

[Ithoriel]

I thought that, though not common, Fatamid and Andalusian armies, at least, used teardrop shaped shields?

Am I about to discover that I have been misled by yet another wargaming myth?

Say it ain't sooooo!!!

[FierceKitty]

The OP wanted the Delhi Sultanate, I think. That would explain it.

[steve_holmes_11]

Turanic Armour

https://periklisdeligiannis.wordpress.com/2015/10/07/turanic-arms-and-armour-part-i/

Turan, an area in Central Asia north and east of Persia.

Turanic becomes the term for Central Asian nomadic origin

.

It's all compatible with OT4 Renaissance Ottoman Sipahi Cavalry


https://www.pendraken.co.uk/not4-nsipahis-cavalry-lance-1423-p.asp

[fsn]

Well there you are. I've learned something. Today is a good day!

Thank you.




I associate Turan with Conan the Barbarian. 

https://conan.fandom.com/wiki/Turan

[steve_holmes_11]

Well there you are. I've learned something. Today is a good day!

Thank you.




I associate Turan with Conan the Barbarian. 

https://conan.fandom.com/wiki/Turan

Turan, Cimmeria: It's all there on the great steppe.

[Raider4]

Turan, Cimmeria: It's all there on the great steppe.

Fair few leagues 'twixt those two mind.

[Rhys]

Turanic Armour

https://periklisdeligiannis.wordpress.com/2015/10/07/turanic-arms-and-armour-part-i/

Turan, an area in Central Asia north and east of Persia.

Turanic becomes the term for Central Asian nomadic origin

It's all compatible with OT4 Renaissance Ottoman Sipahi Cavalry

Thanks for that great resource Steve.
However I'll point out that the Turanic armies were not just lancers. There is nothing suitable for the bow armed armoured
As I suggested before, if Leons tame minions were to do a single pack along the lines of the TB sculpts (horse/legs and figures). If you have 3 horses (scale armour, quilted armour and unarmoured) and 3 scale armoured tops (lance, bow and sword with conical shields), thats 9 different possible poses. Add in the same tops with quilted armour and thats 18 poses. Two packs then covers ~4 centuries of armies for an area from Egypt to Afganistan.
I always laugh when I see questions on why Napoleonic sculpts don't include some obscure shako cords with a differnt pompom....

[steve_holmes_11]

Thanks for that great resource Steve.
However I'll point out that the Turanic armies were not just lancers. There is nothing suitable for the bow armed armoured
As I suggested before, if Leons tame minions were to do a single pack along the lines of the TB sculpts (horse/legs and figures). If you have 3 horses (scale armour, quilted armour and unarmoured) and 3 scale armoured tops (lance, bow and sword with conical shields), thats 9 different possible poses. Add in the same tops with quilted armour and thats 18 poses. Two packs then covers ~4 centuries of armies for an area from Egypt to Afganistan.
I always laugh when I see questions on why Napoleonic sculpts don't include some obscure shako cords with a differnt pompom....

My setting is about 200 years later than the one discussed in this thread.


I've been happy with the TB line horse archers for my needs.

That would be 2 different packs from 2 different sculptors:
  Ottomans for the armoured cavalry and TB line for the light archers.

[GrumpyOldMan]

Hello

You could always look at putting the spear armed camel rider top half onto the horse archer bottoms



There might be more options when the TB Mongols are released. From memory the Mongols had a pack of separate round shields


Cheers

GrumpyOldMan

[sultanbev]

Well, this has sparked some good commentary.
Have now got the Osprey MAA on the medieval Indians, being a David Nicolle book it typically lacks details such as army sizes, unit sizes, command structures, troop ratios and so on.

Looking at the MeG and DBM army lists, it seems most armies would need:
elephants with howdah, archer & javelin armed crew
armoured elephants with howdah, archer & javelin armed crew
Mamluk cavalry with bow and spear, barded horse? (can't see barded horses in both army lists)
Jagirdar cavalry with bow and spear
Islamic Mongols with bow and spear (1294-1311AD only)

foot archers
foot swordsmen in some kind of armour
Hindu Paik/Habishi guard infantry (1266AD+)
spearmen with pavise and some armour
light cavalry with javelin
foot javelinmen
grenadier, fireworks and rocket skirmishers
Rathors Hindu tribute lancer cavalry (1316-1388AD)

I haven't accessed other rules' army lists.