Pendraken Miniatures Forum

Pendraken Rules! => Blitzkrieg Commander IV => Topic started by: Ben Waterhouse on 21 November 2021, 10:08:14 AM

Title: Reprint
Post by: Ben Waterhouse on 21 November 2021, 10:08:14 AM
Is there going to be a reprint of the rules?

Thanks
Ben
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Leon on 21 November 2021, 02:05:59 PM
There will be yes, I just need to make sure that all of the Errata is in there and then I can get it off to the printers.  I'm hoping to have them before Christmas if all goes to plan.
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Ben Waterhouse on 21 November 2021, 02:29:20 PM
Excellent!
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Ithoriel on 21 November 2021, 02:49:18 PM
QuoteThere will be yes, I just need to make sure that all of the Errata is in there and then I can get it off to the printers.  I'm hoping to have them before Christmas if all goes to plan.
No disrespect Leon, I think you (and all at Pendraken) do a great job of providing new stuff while simultaneously keeping the flow of existing stuff out to the customers going!


...but...

" if all goes to plan"

When does that ever happen, to you or to anyone?

To borrow a thought from von Moltke the Elder

"No plan survives contact with reality" :D
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Leon on 21 November 2021, 10:14:25 PM
Quote from: Ithoriel on 21 November 2021, 02:49:18 PMNo disrespect Leon, I think you (and all at Pendraken) do a great job of providing new stuff while simultaneously keeping the flow of existing stuff out to the customers going!


...but...

" if all goes to plan"

When does that ever happen, to you or to anyone?

I can still hope!  I've had a lot of emails about the rules so I definitely need to get it sorted out.  We're away to Warfare Fri-Mon this coming weekend but once we get back from that there's a bit of breathing space to work through the backlog of BKC/CWC/releases/website photos, etc.
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: paulr on 22 November 2021, 05:34:06 AM
QuoteThere will be yes, I just need to make sure that all of the Errata is in there and then I can get it off to the printers.  I'm hoping to have them before Christmas if all goes to plan.

He didn't say which Christmas ;)
No disrespect intended, really
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Ithoriel on 22 November 2021, 12:29:33 PM
Ah,yes!

"It'll all be over by Christmas!" :)



All the best with this Leon. Take Paul and my comments as the equivalent of the theatrical "Break a leg!" :)



Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Itinerant Hobbyist on 31 December 2021, 03:34:42 PM
Leon, I was wondering if you've had any other feedback on the binding? I know we discussed that my copy was falling apart.

I don't know what it takes, besides coil bound, to make rules lay flat when open?

Anyway, looking forward to the reprint.
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Leon on 31 December 2021, 05:01:06 PM
Quote from: Itinerant Hobbyist on 31 December 2021, 03:34:42 PMLeon, I was wondering if you've had any other feedback on the binding? I know we discussed that my copy was falling apart.

We spoke to the printers way back when BKC-IV was done and they said that they'd need to use a stronger glue for any future books.  The problem at the moment is that it's about £6k to get a reprint run from that company and we don't have that kind of money spare. 

We can do lower quantity runs through a digital printer but the price per copy jumps to around £14 each and just isn't viable, so it's a bit of a balancing act.

I've got some other options to look at when we get back to work so we'll see if any of those work out better and then we can decide what to do.  We may have to look at removing the army lists from the book though (as we're going to do with Cold War Commander) to bring the page count and printing costs down.
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: hammurabi70 on 31 December 2021, 05:42:08 PM
QuoteI've got some other options to look at when we get back to work so we'll see if any of those work out better and then we can decide what to do.  We may have to look at removing the army lists from the book though (as we're going to do with Cold War Commander) to bring the page count and printing costs down.

Is spiral or staple viable options?
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Raider4 on 31 December 2021, 05:57:48 PM

QuoteI don't know what it takes, besides coil bound, to make rules lay flat when open?
When Staples was still a thing I've got them to do that to a couple of rulebooks (and a couple of music tuition books) myself. Can't remember how much, but it was cheap enough that I thought it was worth it.
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Leon on 31 December 2021, 06:32:45 PM
Quote from: hammurabi70 on 31 December 2021, 05:42:08 PMIs spiral or staple viable options?

Spiral could potentially be but I'm not sure on it myself?  It can certainly be more practical but it takes away from the 'book' appearance and makes the rules look more like some kind of manual (which granted they are to a certain extent!)  When I've spoken to other rules publishers in the past they've generally recommended against spiral as being less 'professional' if that makes sense?
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Gwydion on 31 December 2021, 07:24:36 PM
The print shop in the village here will shave off the spine binding and put a coil binder through, provided there is enough of a margin before the text, and I've had a couple of rule sets done like that. I can't remember the price but it was cheap enough as I am a skinflint and wouldn't have had it done otherwise!

But if there is a choice I'd always go for a metal spiral bound to start with in preference to a perfect bound paperback - the pages always start coming loose at the top or bottom of the spine.

A proper stitched hardback binding like my copy of Charge! (1968) is great - Charge is still in one piece despite having been reread hundreds of times. But that may make the rules a bit pricy!

(Having said all that my copy of CWC is fine whereas BKCIV is already showing signs of unravelling :-\  odd).
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Heedless Horseman on 31 December 2021, 07:43:20 PM
I am not really a Rules user, but if I may chip in?
When I purchased a couple of Rule sets several years ago, they were very pretty books with nice pics and nearly 1/3 of book comprised of Army Lists. They were expensive.... and binding made them awkward to keep open.

What I wanted was Rules...with maybe pics as explanatory aids, rather than decoration. Army Lists... if I had wanted them, I might have bought as a supplementary volume....with 'potted history of Campaign' sections.

If a Rule Book is liked...and used enough for wear and tear to take its toll... then cheapness would just mean buying another copy.

An Index can be very useful, and an easily readable Font!

Way Back...I used to to use the WRG Rules...and found the separate 'Card' sheets for stuff that,  would be used all the time... Movement and Firing tables, etc.... were great and could be protected with 'sticky backed plastic'... pre photocopy / Laminator age! lol!

Jut my own take on things!
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: hammurabi70 on 01 January 2022, 01:58:47 AM
QuoteSpiral could potentially be but I'm not sure on it myself?  It can certainly be more practical but it takes away from the 'book' appearance and makes the rules look more like some kind of manual (which granted they are to a certain extent!)  When I've spoken to other rules publishers in the past they've generally recommended against spiral as being less 'professional' if that makes sense?

Yes, it is understandable but as Raider4 indicates some players prefer spiral bound and pay for that choice.  It does make rules easier to use and personally I think they are better that way rather than book & QRS but I have no idea how the market would react and can appreciate the image issue.
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Ben Waterhouse on 01 January 2022, 01:09:29 PM
I would much prefer spiral bound.
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Ithoriel on 01 January 2022, 01:47:43 PM
Personally, I prefer my rulebooks to look like books, not manuals but then I rarely have mine open during an actual game.

Spiral bound is not a deal breaker but it would go in the con column if weighing one rule set against another.

I have to say that what sold me on Warmaster and then BKC was the all-in-one-book rules and army lists, after GW's endless escalating Codices. Though I understand the desire to move the lists online it would put me off future purchases but not bar them altogether. 
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: Lord Kermit of Birkenhead on 01 January 2022, 02:29:02 PM
A decent index would help !
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: sultanbev on 01 January 2022, 04:56:25 PM
A limitation of spiral binding is they don't stack easy for the seller, so they take up more room.

I have had many pdfs and other stuff spiral bound at the local printer, which is great for durability but it is true there is that "less professional" look about it.

If the binding is going to fall apart you could be heretical and sell it with pre-punched holes for ring binders.

my BKC.IV book fell apart and I ended up putting each page in plastic wallets and put them in a ring binder, with the cover glued to the front. Only just fits with all the army lists, but without it would be a comfortable fit with space for additional rules/amendments.
Title: Re: Reprint
Post by: John Cook on 02 January 2022, 09:00:58 AM
I've scanned some rules, recipes and other stuff I didn't want spoiled so I can read them on my tablet.