Pendraken Miniatures Forum

Hi.  DaveL here-a new member.

Are you, like me, trying to find that perfect set of ancient rules?  I've been trying and working on the Neil Thomas rules in his Ancient and Medieval Wargames book. I really like them as they're simple and i can actually understand them!!! They're fun and easy to use, but i feel they need tweaking.

I just wondered if anyone else had tried them and if they had any thoughts on them and any alterations/house rules they'd come up with and would be willing to pass on?

Also i've seen an advert in Caliver for some rules called "About Caesar". Has anyone come across them and if so, could they let me know what they think of them.

Thanks.     Best Wishes   DaveL

Warmaster ancients! Done  :P

Don't have any experience with the others  :-[

Hi Davel, and welcome.

Quote from: DaveL on 08 March 2013, 09:45:54 PM
Are you, like me, trying to find that perfect set of ancient rules?

They don't exist, and likely never will as 'personal preference' will always apply.

I'd recommend trying out a variety of differning style of game to see which one suits you best.  Options include:

DBA/DBM/DBMM
DBA v3 is currently in playtest and in big battle mode is a jolly good game, a great improvement on previous versions.
A good web search might bring up the pdf.
DBx isn't for everyone though as it is a bit of a micro-management game.  Personally i reckon this stable of rules is hard to beat.

http://theminiaturespage.com/rules/anc/dba.html (http://theminiaturespage.com/rules/anc/dba.html)

Warmaster Ancients
A much freer ruleset in terms of gameplay, although isn't it out of print since Warhammer Historical was shut down by GW?

Armies are 'epic' scale with each unit being about 3000 men(?) so it has quite a bit of abstraction.
Personally i find the combat resolution painfully fiddly, especially in a confused melee between multiple units. 
People seem to like it though.

Warhammer Ancients
Basically the core GW rule engine battered into a crude semblance of a historical ruleset.  Others love it.
Again, out of print i think?

Field of Glory
The tournament ruleset that killed DBx.
It's recently had a v2 relaunch (bungled by the publishers, but you can get hard copies now).
To be honest its really just a 1.1 upgrade with very little difference so you should be able to pick up cheap rulebooks from v1 second hand.  You'll need the rules and at least one of the 'army books' (there are 13!)
A definite tournament set, full of quirks, and mind-bendingly obtuse rules, but if you can get through the clutter and put up with the brain bleed its a decent set.

It's really a matter of trying a few until you find rules you like.

Good luck!

Or there is Hail Caesar,
Which runs on the Rick Priestly/Warmaster mode.

Some of us quite like it too...

Hail Caesar

Warmaster (Ancients/Medieval)

FoG

Like all three - depending on what mood I am in!

I would add Impetus to the set as well. Completely different game in 10 to 15mm than it is in 28mm. Much more tactical but still looks good with multiple commands making it great for multiplayer games. (That and if like me you have a ton of warmaster stuff, 2 warmaster bases make an impetus unit.)

I've always like Vis bellica, nice command structure has hidden movement and spotting and a nice scouting system which you dont often get in ancient games uses the same sized bases as impetus and was one of the first games to bring in the 60x30 base size..can be used with Dbx FOG impetus bases though as well by butting them together , not really a competition and doesnt work when you use armies from different periods against each other

I would definitiely recommend Dux Bellorum. Its cheap, easy to learn and good for smaller engagements where you only need 6 or 10 stands per side. It can also be used for solo gaming (with a couple of minor tweaks).

There should be an AAR on my blog by the end of the weekend. I had a cracking game of Romano Brits defending a ford against a Saxon war band last weekend, and last night Romano Brits v a Welsh raiding force (on horseback with Javelins, v nasty) that minced the Romano Brits in about 1hr 15 minutes! Heres a pic from the "ford" game:

(http://data8.blog.de/media/292/6912292_e05776d976_l.jpeg)

Cheers,

Craig

I'll second tiny terrain nice set of rules and I am sure they could be expanded to other periods of ancient warfare without much difficulty

Hi to all who took the time and trouble to reply to my request re Ancient rules. Plenty to ponder about there. Loved the picture from Tiny terrain- thanks. My friend Chad told me how friendly and useful the Forum is---i've only been a member for 2 days and I've been amazed already at the friendship and response already given.

Many thanks    DaveL

Aye Dux Bellorum's a great game for sure (http://luddite1811.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/dux-bellorum-saxons-vs-pictish-sea.html (http://luddite1811.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/dux-bellorum-saxons-vs-pictish-sea.html)), however i didn't recomend it as its not really an 'Ancients' rule set.

There is an Ancients conversion available though... http://sumer2sargon.blogspot.com.au/2012/09/warrior-kings-rules.html (http://sumer2sargon.blogspot.com.au/2012/09/warrior-kings-rules.html)

:)

My preference is DBMM. Easy to play once youve played 1 game. Takes longer to master.
You can play DBMM100 with anything from 7 bases per side (High Points per figure).
visit http://www.tagmata.it/
It will show 240 point armies with lists, Pics, and battle reports
Forum www.dbmm.org.uk will answer your questions as will the yahoo group http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/DBMMlist/
Lots favour 10mm. armies for the 50% more figures you can get on a base.

Phil steele's Zama refight looked most impressive and so did the elephants.
mike

I've written a set based on Fire & Fury if you like traditional figure ratios 1 fig = 20, although could be used 1 fg = 40. I use them occasionally with 20mm plastics.

Email me on sultanbev@googlemail.com if you want a free copy.

Mark

I'd second Impetus. You can try the free version at their website too.

I recommend warmaster ancient.

Baccus also does their new Roman period version of their polemos stable for something different  :-\

Polemus is like Marmite, you'll either love it or it'll make you feel ill.

Quote from: GordonY on 15 March 2013, 02:25:31 PM
Polemus is like Marmite, you'll either love it or it'll make you feel ill.

Aye, i played their Franco-Prussian War rules and initially though, 'ooh these are pretty good'.  About an hour into the first game the novelty VERY VERY much wore off.    :(

Yes. Chad and I tried Polemos rules for Franco-Prussian. 

I think we got to the end of move 2 and gave up!  Sorry but didn't like them.

However, when basing my Macedonian phalanx, I have used their idea and had the front ground extending past the tips of the pikes-very good idea for protecting the bendy pikes!

DaveL

i've heard this before about Polemos - whats the issue with them ?

Well i found the combat example fidly when i read it on the site, so maybe the rules are even more fiddly  :-\

https://www.baccus6mm.com/includes/polemos/naps/GDDsample.pdf

I have version one of the Napoleonics and to be honest they are just badly written I think with the examples not really explaining anything. Not sure if version 2 has improved this but has put me off trying any of the others

I wouldn't dismiss the whole stable because of experiences with individual sets.  The first set, on the ECW, was ground breaking, and the 2nd edition tidied up most of the teething problems.  I found both the War of the Spanish Succession and the Great Northern War rules were very well thought out, and really seemed to represent what I had read of the period.  I confess, I found more difficulty with the Napoleonic, ACW and FPW variants. Somehow, they didn't capture the 'feel' of the period, which for me is to inject something of the tactical distinction of the period, even into rules which are at a higher level.  I have had a look at, but not played, the SPQR set, and they look as if they could work.  Horses for courses, in the end. I am still looking forward to the SYW version which is expected later this year, as I think the basic mechanics should work well.

Mollinary

Maybe have a looksie here:

http://www.wrg.me.uk/WRG.net/History/wrg.html

You never know you fancy something :p

You might like to give Hail Caesar a try. We've had some entertaining games with them. Fairly easy to pick up as far as the learning curve goes. Perhaps not as specialised as some other sets, but a good all-rounder, particularly for big battles.

Hi,

A little delayed, but as promised here's a link to the full battle report for my recent Romano Brits v Saxons scrap using Dux bellorum:

http://wargames.blog.co.uk/2013/03/03/test-post-15585297/

Best regards,

Craig
Tiny Terrain Models.