I've been planning this one for some time. I have a much loved copy of the original B2, from the dawn of time, and could never work out how to do it as a solo miniatures game. In 28 mm? Do me a favour, far too difficult, much too big, too much painting.
In 10mm however there is another possibility, that of building both the Keep, and the Caves of Chaos, site of an infestation of evil that our heroes must clear out.
The Keep would double as a castle for my 10mm feudal armies, the caves would be a section by section build, and just to show that it's not such a crazy idea I should explain that it would be as a card model project. I don't fancy spending months doing a solid model, or spending a fortune on loads of resin.
I do, of course, have one or two issues. The Keep and the dungeons will have to match the original 1980s plans as exactly as possible. I will keep the encounter and story line as close as possible, but will build in several solo elements. Firstly two teams of adventurers will compete to explore the caves. They will use an initiative system based on the rumour table, that will make sure that both teams get an even chance. Secondly I will use a wilderness tabletop that has to be crossed to go between the Caves and the Keep. This will have a random encounter system that is essentially card based. When a card is drawn to generate an encounter it will not be returned to the deck, making sure that the journey is always different.
My initial idea was that the team that gets the most points wins the campaign, but on reflection I think that the heroes that eventually defeat the evil Cleric, the "Boss Level" of the Caves, will be the winners.
As research I have gone through the original B2, as well as the later updated version, and the Return to the Keep on the Borderland, a follow on module. The Ru Emerson novel Keep on the Borderlands has also been a source of inspiration, as have several online blog reports of Keep games.
The card models are from E-Z Dungeons. I would love resin modules (and have a dozen Pendraken rooms worth) but I want a lot of them, and space may be prohibitive given the size of the caves.
I am also open to advice. For instance I've made no real decision about rules yet. Possibly my home grown ones would do, since they are solo designed. In any event my intention for the campaign is to post the game mechanics, cards, solo tables and pictures here.
I will keep you posted.
Hi Dave, welcome to the Forum! I like the sound of this, keep us updated!
8)
This sounds like the kind of crazy thing I do from time to time. as solo projects just for little old me to enjoy (a relief from some of my other more normal games). I like the ideas and thinking you have put into this... really look forward to hearing more about it and seeing it finished... with some photos? Sounds like a long project though. Keep up the great work :-)
Six
Sounds great Dave - looking forward to seeing progress on this one 8)
Rules? If you're going all retro with B2 then, IMHO, there's nothing whatoever wrong with Basic D&D :-bd <)
The Keep on the Borderlands, eh? Gosh that takes me back. I always liked the 'starter' modules the best. B2 and T1 and U1. Ahh, happy days. Good luck with your project.
Quote from: nikharwood on 23 June 2012, 10:28:53 AM
Rules? If you're going all retro with B2 then, IMHO, there's nothing whatoever wrong with Basic D&D :-bd <)
Of all the things I've sold, or given, or thrown away over the years, I have two major regrets. All the Lego (and there was a lot) I threw out when I left my parents home, and my original AD&D 1st edition books. I really wish I'd kept them.
/sigh.
Cheers, Martyn
--
Just an attempt to upload a photograph. I`m not exactly "Mr Tech."
Thanks for the advice about Basic D&D. I may well go that route! I want to change as little of the original Gygax storyline as possible, so the original rules would probably be for the best.
I had to smile at Martyn's comment, I once gave away an original set of Judges Guild City State Of the World Emperor, Invincible Overlord, and Tegel Manor. I could pay my mortgage if I could sell that lot on ebay these days. I still wake up in a cold sweat thinking about it.
The Kobold section of the cave is about half done. I have to add the bushes for the outside area and tidy up the caves themselves. I`m quite pleased with it so far however.
(http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/5664/caves1.jpg)
That looks really good. I toyed with the idea of building the Caves in a style matching my earlier dungeon tiles, but gave up when I realized just how big the caves really are. Even at 15mm squares I was looking at more dungeon than could fit on my table, and my construction method was too detailed to be able to finish it before my gamer-ADD kicked in. Good on you for finding a way to do this.
You're making good progress there Dave, and it looks very effective 8)
Keep us updated.
Cheers,
Kev
Great stuff Dave :D
Brings back happy(and slightly befuddled) memories of student days, graph paper and Zircon the Cleric striding forth. I believe that Zircon and his companions may well be in a trunk in the attic, halted in their adventure by a move from one country to another. This could be what is needed to get them back adventuring.
Looking forward to seeing how this develops.
Bree-yark my friends!
Solo game mechanisms,
In his classic module Keep on the Borderlands Gary Gygax, one of my all time great wargaming heroes, used a rumour table to add depth to the adventure story. I wanted to use these for my retelling of the tale as a solo game. Gary gave us a list of 20 rumours that can be picked up at the keep. Some of these are false, and the DM can see an “F†next to these in the original list. In my game all of these may be true. They just have to be tested. As an example here are the first ten rumours from the list:
1. A merchant imprisoned in the caves will reward his rescuers.
2. A powerful magic user will destroy all cave invaders
3. Tribes of different creatures live in different caves,
4. An Ogre sometimes helps the cave dwellers
5. A magic wand was lost in the caves area.
6. All of the cave entrances are trapped
7. If you get lost beware the eater of men
8. Altars are very dangerous
9. A fair maiden is imprisoned within the caves
10. “Bree-yark†is goblin-language for “we surrenderâ€
…
This is a solo game. I do not want to know which rumours are true and which are false until the game is underway. The solution is a deck of cards, and some coloured self adhesive dots. In my caves the green dots represent rumours. (I will tell you about the other colours as I get to them) Since the Caves of chaos are divided into several areas I allocate two dots to each area. When one of my Pendraken figures crosses the dot I draw a random card.
The way this works in practice does slightly change the canon of Gygax narrative. If I draw the “A merchant imprisoned in the caves will reward his rescuers†card in the first corridor of the Kobold section of the caves I roll a dice. A random number means it is a lie, for now since it may come up again and I will re-roll, or if true it is the Kobolds who have the Merchant held hostage, and I use the description of the merchant from later in the module. It also means that I have to rescue a merchant from the nasty little dog faced guys. (I'm awaiting the delivery of some Pendraken Beestmen to play the role of the Kobolds)
I feel justified in doing this. It makes the module more random for my solo game, and allows me to use the table as part of my game. I have added to the deck (Gary himself suggested doing this) by using this as part of my “wandering monster†system. Ten of my cards represent wandering monsters, but they don’t say what type of monster, since that is usually dependent on which section of the caves the party is in at the time.
It`s not a perfect solution but I am open to any further ideas on it.
I am still painting monsters for my terrain. The Orc caves are now done, so I have the north eastern side of the caves completed. The Orc caves are higher than the Kobold ones, and rest above them to the rear. I hope to repeat this pattern for the circuit of the valley.
I also changed my original idea and intend to run three adventure teams, using a different manufacturers figures to make up each team. These reports will focus only on the Pendraken adventurers group. The others are there only to be beaten to the prize. This figures as part of my solo gaming. I intend to be biased towards the Pendraken guys. The three companies will be an Evil one, a Neutral one and a Good one. My heart has always been with the neutrals, they cause far less harm in the world than the other guys seem to do!
Sounds great Dave - I think your system here is a good one: nice & simple but will give a satisfying solo game I think; looking forward to seeing more of this 8)
Oh - and I love kobolds :d
Oh, blimey! Keep on the Borderlands, that takes me back. I had it as part of the basic D&D box bought in '82, and kept it until I emigrated. I gave it to a mate of mine, who'd just introduced his son to D&D, so it's gone to inspire a new generation. :)
Good luck with your project, I'm interested in seeing how you get on.
Bree-Yark fellow adventurers,
Just a quick update. I have completed the top side of the caves, although it has taken quite a while to get the basic layout correct. I am using the Map from the Return to the Keep on the Borderlands, mainly because the original blue and white 1980s version would not have been half as effective. The cave walls are EZ Dungeon, but the area for the Evil Cleric will use Pendraken resin, to reflect the status of the Boss level. These are also more of a traditional dungeon, rather than “caves.†In addition to this I have completed the gatehouse for the Keep.
My Pendraken Goblins are also well on the way to being finished. The Goblin Lair set includes some lovely Ogre figures that will give some nice character to my caves Ogre. This is a long term project, but it’s on track so far.
Last time I discussed some solo mechanisms I have planned for the game, basically linking the rumours table to encounters in the caves. This uses a system of random green dots that when crossed by a figure trigger an encounter, and I use cards to plan this, so that I can stack the deck. This time I will explain how I use the red dots.
My Keep game is a solo project. It will be in essence a board game. The Keep will represent the place of refuge and safety for my heroes to recuperate, but it will also act as a place for sub plots, some of which can be as dangerous as the caves. Gary Gygax set one main sub plot into the original module, centred on the Curate in the Keep, who is not all that he appears to be. To reflect this I will keep a separate set of cards (and get this… I intend to build a “card holding†building into the model. Like Monopoly I will be able to draw a card from the board. Other buildings will be open, some with furniture, to allow figures entry into them. Crossing a red dot means activating a sub plot.
In the caves crossing a red dot also means activating a sub plot. The excellent thing about the design of the caves is that the player can’t help but move figures across the dots. They can’t be avoided. Here however there is less scope for a sub plot to run. If you are clearing the Kobold lair then the Kobolds have their own plan to defend against you, so it is difficult to randomise or develop a sub plot. There however some plots you can activate. Rivalry within adventuring parties can be developed. One sub plot card could be “An argument breaks out between two randomly selected characters in the party. Roll a D6. A roll of 1 indicates that this is just a spat. They will be friends again by the end of this section of the caves. A roll of 6 means that a deadly insult has been offered. It can only end in violence.â€
On the other hand when the characters are within the caves events could be changing on the outside. One of the areas the module neglects is the political and Military dimension happening at the Keep, as well as the shifting alliances and power struggles in the Caves. The sub plots based around these might be things like, “The Orc leaders meet to discuss the attacks on the caves by adventurers. A strong patrol of Orcs will be sent out into the valley during the night.â€
Ah well time to get back to the workbench!
Really interesting stuff... I`m following the course of this one with close interest.
Out of interest, what rules do you intend to use when you finally get round to playing the game?
Rules are a bit of an issue.
My planning for campaign mechanisms is quite advanced, but the actual game mechanics are still up in the air.
I have a homegrown set, back of a postcard, but (very) loosely based on basic D&D. On the other hand proper Basic D&D are not what I would term as solo friendly.
Maybe a few modifications would work.
As you may have figured out I have quite a thorough planning approach to my games, and for this one I am keen to get it right.
Keeping this as a D&D game would allow me to keep it nearer to Gygax original intention... and the "magic" system and balance for the caves, would work.
On the other hand... I have enjoyed reading some of the rules threads on this forum.
They are more modern ( although I`m not sure if that's what I am after either) and designed for the "figure" type of game.
Still not sure. I`m clearly leaning towards classic D&D circa 1979. I am open to suggestions.
Re: rules. A couple of years ago there was a sudden explosion of 'retro-clones' - basically people releasing new rule sets based very closely on the D&D games they remembered from their youth.
Labrynth Lord is a clone of the Basic/Expert D&D game from about 1981.
Swords & Wizardry is based more on the original D&D from the mid 1970's. S&W Whitebox is my favourite, based on the original 3 booklets of D&D.
OSRIC is is a clone of the 1st edition AD&D, I think.
All freebie downloads, at least in a basic form.
Cheers, Martyn
Yes - Martyn's mentioned the best clones - all worth a look :)
White Box D&D is still my favourite of them all... sadly I rarely use it now because I was long ago seduced into 3.5 and Pathfinder and tend to leave the old classic in its box on the shelf in its enshrined place of pride.
Breeyark fellow adventurers
my campaign is still growing, although a holiday in Cyprus and a broken printer have delayed things.
I have my three adventuring teams painted up and ready for action, and am now painting and mustering the figures I need for the creatures.
If my (limited) skills in I.T. will allow it I will try to post some pictures to show the progress, the Pendraken figures are mainly those from the adventurer pack, although a couple of Dark elves have been added.
(http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t446/bigdave95/IMGP3223.jpg)
(http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t446/bigdave95/IMGP3236.jpg)
(http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t446/bigdave95/IMGP3229.jpg)
Looking good!Nice job on the dwarves, those dungeon walls are really looking weathered in! 8)
Excellent, looking good there! I'm looking forward to this one kicking off!
8)
Looking good...but 'Gavin'??! :o ;D :D :d
Quote from: nikharwood on 01 August 2012, 09:37:50 PM
Looking good...but 'Gavin'??! :o ;D :D :d
If he's anything like his namesake in Mark Harrison's cartoon strip, then steer well clear! ;D
http://www.2000ad.org/markus/travellers/image.php?page=21
Seriously, nice work on the Borderlands module!
Looks impressive.
Just waiting for them go through the arched window as Big Ted used to say on Playschool .
Oh dear, perhaps I'm going a bit too retro here ;D
Well yes, quite, Gavin... I took the names of the characters from the "Shady Dragon Inn" list of Lower level pre_rolled parties. I almost always label the figures for a solo game since it helps me to identify with the charaters, and as for Gavin... he is the Pendraken guy with the big club, no armour just a big club. I haven't even rolled the stats for them yet.
I reckon Gavin is probably a Thief of some sort!
Anyway there was a kid at school I rweally hated whose name was Gavin so I look forward to getting him into some nasty situations.
Here are another couple of pictures including the Hero shot of the party outside the Kobold lair!
These have the base map underneath. Looks better I think.
(http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t446/bigdave95/IMGP3241.jpg)
(http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t446/bigdave95/IMGP3239.jpg)
Excellent :)
Fantastic 8) I'm looking forward to seeing the action!
Cheers,
Kev
Interesting.
Rules wise you could look at Song of Blades and Heroes as they play well for solo and are pretty cheap as a pdf.
Terrific stuff, Big Dave.
:-\ I wonder what Leon's going to call the chaos knight/wight that I've just sent up.
He had a working title of 'Colin', while I was pushing the putty about.
(Yes, OK, I know...I've got no imagination when it comes to names) ;)
Cheers - Phil.
Quote from: Techno on 03 August 2012, 08:11:32 AM
:-\ I wonder what Leon's going to call the chaos knight/wight that I've just sent up.
We shall call him...
...Colin. :-[
;D
Perfect 8)
Cheers,
Kev
Breeyark fellow adventurers,
The Kobolds... well beestmen really, ready for action.
It's taken me a while to get these guys ready. Not least because I still haven't sourced some proper giant rats, that well known Kobold pet. I will be investing in the rat lair dungeon pack in due course but for now the part of the rats is being taken by some sunflower seeds, good size and right shape when a tail is added.
Clearly the Pendraken Beestmen are goat faced guys, but at this scale I`ll live with it. They are also a tad large, and will be filling in as Gnolls elsewhere in the Keep module. I wish I could source some 10mm dog men. They feature a single Pendraken pack each of swords, spears and bows. I used three as command figures, the big boss on a penny, and the two lieutenants on one cent Euros (the perfect coin for 10mm in my opinion!)
I left them as bland as possible, no bright shields, no light colours, and I may dip them just to get a darker look. In places my acrylics are patchy on these, but I quite liked the effect.
The Orcs, next out of the production line, are a very different painting prospect.
I still have a lot of the caves to build, and the Keep itself is only just getting going.
(http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t446/bigdave95/IMGP3247.jpg)(http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t446/bigdave95/IMGP3245.jpg)
Very nice Dave 8)
Good idea on the sunflower seeds too!
One word - SWEET!
=D>
Really nice, and the sunflower seeds do look effective. :)
Inspired.