Initially sceptical, the more I saw of Strength & Honour the more intrigued I became. Eventually the TFL Youtube videos of the game being played sold me on the idea.
Of course, I wouldn't be me if I went with the suggestions in the rules!
So, 50mm squares, 80mm x 40mm bases, Irregular miniatures rather than the bases designed for the game, Setback and Disaster cards knocked up in Open Office and home printed then sleeved in card sleeves I already had with an old CCG card as stiffener.
Taking to the one corner of my dining table that isn't either emulating a builder's merchant or a food bank I played a small game using empty bases marked up to show what they were. Which confirmed my thought that this could easily have been a board game. Though it wouldn't have looked half so pretty as the stuff currently being produced by players.
I have half a suspicion that I am going derive at least as much pleasure from producing 2mm scenery as I do from playing the game!
One thing that irked me was that the card command board kept getting "shoogled" with dice gently creeping around the board.
So, I decided to create something more solid.
Off to Warbases for a kosher S&H Roman Camp and Wagon Laager and, while I was at it, a pile of MDF. Figure bases, terrain bases and ... components for a Command Board .... or two.
Et, voila! One 150mm square, 2mm MDF round cornered base (a custom size), two 90mmx10mm rectangular bases, one 70mm x 10mm rectangular base, six 25mmx10mm rectangular bases, six Quad 10mm dice frames and two of their MDF mini-token 1-10 sets.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/4341/PgNsMc.jpg)
Which became this
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/5409/Fam1Bs.jpg)
And then, with the addition of paint and home printed labels, this
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/4415/dJI8sq.jpg)
and finally, as it might be in action
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/5964/nj2ycD.jpg)
like it! Looks very neat and tidy. :)
Damn your eyes, stop giving me ideas for more projects not to finish :D
Good idea!
This game has also bitten my biscuit as well. I've ordered the rules and am looking at figure options.
>> I have half a suspicion that I am going derive at least as much pleasure from producing 2mm scenery as I do from playing the game!
Definitely agree here, particularly as the scenery tutorials shown on Youtube look eminently do-able. Also some great terrain pieces available on-line (I'm thinking of the Roman Camp and City tiles from Korhyl).
I came to the conclusion long ago that no matter what scale you do, they are all as expensive as each other. As the scale gets smaller the size of the armies gets bigger, as does the number of armies you collect.
QuoteThis game has also bitten my biscuit as well. I've ordered the rules and am looking at figure options.
>> I have half a suspicion that I am going derive at least as much pleasure from producing 2mm scenery as I do from playing the game!
Definitely agree here, particularly as the scenery tutorials shown on Youtube look eminently do-able. Also some great terrain pieces available on-line (I'm thinking of the Roman Camp and City tiles from Korhyl).
I have two Roman camp sets from Warbases Antonine range to make a complete camp plus I have their wagon laager.
I also have some of Brigade's modular castle pieces to make a city wall and some of their Roman buildings to fill it. Plus their Dark Age Village which will do as a small Gallic village, I reckon.
Villages, woods, farms, marshes look eminently doable.
Hills I'm less certain of given that units may span flat and elevation leaving them at drunken angles unless the hills are relatively flat.
I think I will leave the crossing of that particular bridge until I come to it :)
I am quite taken with Irregular's base of pigs so may yet have a 2mm scale piggery. Am I wrong to be somewhat amused that they have figures that can be cows or horses depending on paint job? Won't stop me getting some though!
Looking good
Nice work
QuoteI came to the conclusion long ago that no matter what scale you do, they are all as expensive as each other. As the scale gets smaller the size of the armies gets bigger, as does the number of armies you collect.
It's been a while.
When packs of 6mm were £2.00, I did some comparisons.
It showed that the smaller scales were cheaper, though not necessarily as much as you'd imagine.
The one that sticks in my head was 1 28mm figure at £2.00 occupying similar footprint to 12 6mms costing £0.50.
It's worth noting that those 6mm packs are now listed at £5.00 while Foundry 28mms are in the £1.50 - £1.80 range.
This reduces the deficit to £1.25 for the smalls and £1.80 for the expensive bigs.
I have a feeling that this scale will definitely encourage terrain megalomania ! Brigade Models will certainly be extremely useful and I can see some form of Roman town on the horizon. I expect that good terrain will be even more important given the size of the figure blocks.
The one area that will prove a significant change for me is the gridded playing surface. I know a number of games already employ this idea but it does mean investigating methods of temporary marking (perhaps small pieces of clump foliage). It'll be interesting to see how people achieve this.
Phil
I like that! 2mm terrain does look fantastic en masse, can really give the feel of proper settlements and vast terrain features. I liked the idea in one of the TFL videos of using the magnetic labels and just placing one of those in the woods to indicate a unit in there, works quite well at the scale and would allow you to do large forested areas without worrying too much about getting figures round them.
QuoteThe one area that will prove a significant change for me is the gridded playing surface. I know a number of games already employ this idea but it does mean investigating methods of temporary marking (perhaps small pieces of clump foliage). It'll be interesting to see how people achieve this.
For gridded games I keep a container full of random foilage and stones to lay out the grid with. If you find you enjoy it enough it's well worth making a permanent one (even just some dark green dots on a green sheet to mark out the corners works well) but having the foliage does help add character.
I just got a big sheet of greaseproof paper and did a dollop of glue and some bits of flock, clumps, stones, etc on each dollop. once dry and sprayed with varnish/watered down pva, they lift right off the sheet and give you a handy corner piece.
Another option is to use tile spacers, possibly painted to merge in with the table.
Thanks to all for the kind comments.
Being somewhat of an obsessive - "I have CDO ... it's like OCD but the letters are in the right order" - I have a mat in transit from Tiny Wargames with a 50mm grid specifically for this.
At least, I hope it's in transit ... been a while since they despatched it. :(
MMCV. Some great ideas to create a temporary gridded playing mat. As you say, if our group do like the game, we will have to investigate a more permanent solution.
Ithoriel. Very much like the mini-mat idea and DIY command board. Hope the Tiny Wargames mat arrives soon !
Phil
A first go at a unit for Strength and Honour.
I described the suggested painting style as somewhere between Impressionism and Pointilism!
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/7065/3nv83y.jpg)
Not 100% happy with the result but happy with it as a first go. It looks better from a distance ... ar maybe that's just my eyesight :D
620 men in 10 cohorts and a colour guard for the Eagle, so a little understrength :)
Compulsory units for the list I'm using are General, 3 legions and a unit of skirmishers after which I'm looking at cavalry, an allied Gallic warband or two, more legions and skirmishers, maybe even a unit of elephants.
:-bd =D> :-bd
I wonder if a green/brown/blue background for the label, maybe with white letters, would blend in a little more, letting the figures stand out a bit more :-\
I want the label to stand out Paul. I want an opponent to be able to tell from the other side of the table which unit they are looking at.
I think I need to brighten the colours. Silver washed in soft tone rather than gunmetal lightly drybrushed silver. Layering the red over white rather than the base gunmetal for shields. That sort of thing.
I'd like a bit more chinchilla dust texturing the base too instead of random bits here and there.
I little more time taken might help!
Impressive, really look the part
Quote from: Ithoriel on 02 June 2022, 09:33:03 PMI want the label to stand out Paul. I want an opponent to be able to tell from the other side of the table which unit they are looking at...
Good point :)
Quote from: Lord Speedy of Leighton on 02 June 2022, 10:01:58 PMImpressive, really look the part
Seconded - massed 2mm does look very tasty!
Does look the part, though you certainly have to go much brighter colour wise for things to stand out at that distance and scale.
First piece of terrain for Strength and Honour done.
A farm with an orchard and some bushes (vines?).
Buildings are from Brigade Models' Small Scale Scenery range, trees are the ends of bamboo stemmed cotton buds dipped in wood glue then twirled in chinchilla dust and the bushes are lengths of green pipe cleaner.
https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/8833/bwRknk.jpg
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/8833/bwRknk.jpg)
https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/5372/HfoS7S.jpg
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/5372/HfoS7S.jpg)
A whole Roman town is under construction! Pictures to follow.
:-bd =D> :-bd =D>
Great to see a return to DIY terrain :)
Fantastic, that's a great idea using the cotton buds
Very nice terrain work. Also working on armies & some terrain for that system.
Thanks folks.
Work continues on the town.
That's cool. Looking forward to seeing the town
The town goes on apace. Wonky walls and all.
Slightly misjudged the space the thing would take up so squidged the walls to make them fit. But, hey, real town walls aren't straight either.
The temple of Jupiter Optimus Magnus was painted in situ, other buildings are being painted separately and will be glued in place as they are completed.
The town walls are from Brigade Models Small Scale Scenery range.
Specific packs were
2 x SSS-8120 Curtain Walls (pack of 4)
1 x SSS-8120a Walls with Round Bastion (pack of 2)
1 x SSS-8122s Square Towers (pack of 4)
2 x SSS-8123a Gatehouse Type-1
The enormous temple, which dwarfs the surrounding buildings as St Paul's or York Minster do, is
SSS-8061 Roman Temple
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/4969/PTwoX1.jpg)
Hi Ithoriel
Really enjoying this thread and seeing the work put in. Looking forward to some thoughts on the rules themselves. =D>
Cheers Paul
Quote from: mmcv on 08 June 2022, 01:25:08 PMFantastic, that's a great idea using the cotton buds
They make great splash markers for naval games as well
Thanks once again for the comments.
So, now I give you the Roman(-ised?) town of Numquam :)
My plan at the moment is to run a solo campaign set in Italy, Gaul and Spain .... so I need to stop having fun with terrain and get some troops painted.
Therefore projects currently under way for this are ... err .... a Gallic Village (actually a Dark Age one from Brigade Models) and a bathmat wood. Doh! :)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/3073/OBN79O.jpg)
Love that, really shows the benefits of the smaller scale.
I don't need another project...I don't need another project...
:-bd =D> :-bd =D>
How big is the town?
To answer Paul first, the town base 150mm square.
A couple more items complete.
First up is a Brigade Models' Small Scale Scenery British Dark Age village masquerading as a Gallic one. Sorry, I couldn't find a 2mm small Gaul, large Gaul, druid and small dog.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/7095/VXHVqy.jpg)
Next up is a forest made from a chunk of bathmat
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/9696/A0Huws.jpg)
Next batch waiting to be done are actual units!! There will be blood heffalumps!
:-bd =D> :-bd
What would the outer wall of the 'village' be made of, stone :-\
Lovely work! What armies are you going to build, apart from a roman one?
Quote:-bd =D> :-bd
What would the outer wall of the 'village' be made of, stone :-\
Let's check our primary source:
(https://www.asterix.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/Panneau_Accueil2-1-1024x448.png)
(From https://www.asterix.com/en/welcome-to-the-virtual-village/ (https://www.asterix.com/en/welcome-to-the-virtual-village/))
;D
Well, given the image is from one of the set texts from my University Archaeology course I must, of course, give it credence. However, the model definitely looks to me as if it has a stone reinforced wall rather than a wooden palisade. :)
@collegialhoagie - Current plan is two Roman forces, one Gallic, one German and one Spanish but knowing me I may wind up with only the one Roman army with nothing to fight or one of every army in the lists! No plan of mine survives contact with reality :)
Thanks for the comments (and amusement) folks!
Surely the wall be made of what was locally and easily available?
You wouldn't (for example) build a wooden wall in Shetland because there are no trees. Not a problem in some of the leafier areas of the world where wood would be easier to source than having to dig up rocks.
Ithoriel
You will be happy to note strength and honor has also made to the farther reaches of the empire, even here.
Also trying for romans & gauls (& yes too many projects on the go here). There is a gentleman from a northern (?) club in the UK who has modified the rules & first started doing war of the roses & then early renessaince... you may have seen his own pictures on the rules FB page. In any case the pike blocks look very impressive.
Carry on ..looks like you are doing nice work.
Bob
Exactly so, fsn, you go with what you have in these things. Perhaps I need to model a rock quarry?
Antioch, glad it's tendrils are spreading :)
I've heard about the Medieval version but don't do Facebook - too toxic an environment for my tastes.
I am playing about with ideas for a Sumerian version though. Early days and hampered by my gridded mat from Tiny Wargames having been eaten by the delivery system. :( Local joke is that Hermes rebranded as Evri because evri parcel is lost, damaged or stolen maybe it's true of all carriers :o
Now, how to source 2mm Sumerian Battle carts? I already have stl's that would do as spearmen, archers and "nim", at a pinch.
I would try posting some of those medieval pictures but haven't bothered to read the how too section yet. It seems there is a lot of 3d file modifications going on but in the 1 game I played the mechanics look very sound. A lot of the games I have seem appear to be very close & gack dare I use the word...Fun. Of course the older one gets the more important that part seems to be.
In any case good luck with you dissapearing mat & especially with those Sumarian battle carts.
Bob
Great looking terrain Mike, like that bathmat forest.
Quote from: Antioch on 13 June 2022, 03:25:29 PMIthoriel
You will be happy to note strength and honor has also made to the farther reaches of the empire, even here.
Also trying for romans & gauls (& yes too many projects on the go here). There is a gentleman from a northern (?) club in the UK who has modified the rules & first started doing war of the roses & then early renessaince... you may have seen his own pictures on the rules FB page. In any case the pike blocks look very impressive.
Carry on ..looks like you are doing nice work.
Bob
And even to the farthest reaches of the empire!
Do you have any links to the War of the Roses/Early Rennaissance modifications Bob? My googling did not turn up anything.
Charles the Bold's Duchy of Burgundy vs the Swiss in 2mm would be interesting......off I go down another rabbit hole @-)
Pierre,
Sorry no official or unofficial modifications have been posted... Just pictures of the units (mighty nice pictures too) They are posted on the Strength & Homor FB page by a chap named Paul Clarke in one of the gaming clubs around sheffield. They seem to be doing there own thing & are not supported by Mark the author of the rules. PM me your email address & I can send over the screen shots I have. From what I have seen they have or are using for 100 years war, war of the roses & started in on Burgundian wars.
Sorry about all I have on this. Bob
OK thanks very much for the info Bob, I will PM you a little later.
Cheers Peter
Quote...
Charles the Bold's Duchy of Burgundy vs the Swiss in 2mm would be interesting......off I go down another rabbit hole @-)
I'm not going to be painting them ;)
A few more bits and pieces finally completed.
A fortlet, mansio (Roman Travelodge for officials and VIPs) and a paddock of horses for messengers and others requiring a remount.
A small wood
A small Roman marching camp. Much larger one under construction.
In front, a unit of Siege Engines. Of course, there are no rules for siege engines in Strength and Honour but it was easy to come up with some unit stats I was happy with. With a walled, Romanised town and a Gallic village completed and a walled port underway a siege unit could not be resisted. The Baccus 6mm artillery makes excellent 2mm large engines.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/4756/Hlxoz1.jpg)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/7808/JZr3sw.jpg)
That looks awesome!
Very cool
:-bd =D> :-bd
Has me wondering if Caligula got his diminutive nickname from spending time with 2mm legions (or Legiones, if you are Mr Barker, who can't resist using the Latin word, failing to consider the necessary case, and sticking in an initial capital, possibly under the impression that Latin and German are the same language).
Rant over - project looking fun, Mike. When are we going to see those 1:4800 ships?
Lovely work Mike. :-bd
=D> =D> =D>
I'm really impressed that a new 2mm movement has unleashed such creativity.
Until now, I was fairly unimpressed by the Irregular 2mm strips, and really didn't see much in the Strength and Honour specific bare metal.
There's certainly an element of good impressionist painting going on.
I'm also very impressed with Ithoriel's mini diorama approach with the camps and the elephants.
Good stuff there
Very nice
Gentlemen, thank for the many nice comments.
Having failed to acquire a mat from Tiny Wargames I went online and found a site that would print fabric for me to my own design. Created a very basic green square, 50mm on a side, with a black dot in the corners, tiled a 1800mm x 1200mm fabric sheet with it and ordered the result, which arrived today. Not a patch, aesthetically, on the Tiny Wargames one but with the bonus of actually existing. Could undoubtedly do better if I ever make a second one.
That portion of my Roman army that is actually painted set on a chunk of the mat in the pic below.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/9601/FfivZG.jpg)
Also completed a second command board so now have one each for Redforce and Blueforce.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/442/zNs1a1.jpg)
I'm liking the look of your mini romans!
And the organisers look good too
:-bd =D> :-bd
After a long hiatus, things are finally moving again!
How long that will last ..... time will tell!
However, my dining table no longer resembles a builder's merchant's yard.
Instead it currently looks like a chunk of ancient Gaul that's in dire need of ironing :D
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/8463/Fk4KiY.jpg)
The army is growing slowly, with two more legions finally finished and two units of light infantry started.
The painted stuff on the march.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/9609/CnzVhp.jpg)
Light infantry can be a unit or split into up to four skirmish lines or into one or more skirmish lines and up to three reserve lines. So the two units I'm doing currently are actually 16 component elements to allow for all the options.
Compulsory units for the army I'm doing, Late Republican Warlord, are a general, one veteran and two experienced legions and a unit of skirmishers.
I do like those bases of the 2mm troops. They do have the look of big units of troops. I like yours more than some I saw on the original demo videos, I think the red helps make them pop from the base more.
I think your very flat bare Gaul may need some more terrain. Some ridge or hill lines would be a good start - at this scale you should be able to do some quite natural looking hills with shapes / layers under the cloth. Other terrain wise, I have no idea, I don't really know how cleared terrain was in this era
Thanks, fred.
There's a whole port city out of shot bottom left and a stone fort (actually Qasr B'shir, a Late Roman frontier fort in what is now Jordan) as well as the large camp in the top photo, all base coated but waiting to be painted.
There's most of a bathmat's worth of forest waiting in the wings and an assortment of Romanised and Gallic farms, fortified and unfortified baggage, rivers, lakes, marshes, bridges and hills all waiting to be assembled and painted.
Not to mention the Romans to finish and the Gauls to be started.
All before enthusiasm for another project grabs me and I'm off down another rabbit hole! :)
I knew you'd have it covered!
The terrain is probably the biggest thing to do with a new scale. As you list out, there is quite a lot of different stuff needed. I'd suggest going with the forest first as you should be able to get a good area done pretty quickly, and in game wise it is always useful!
:-bd =D> :-bd =D>
I'd suggest bumping some Gauls up the painting queue a little so you can get some games in to help maintain interest & enthusiasm
Slowly getting paint on figures for Strength and Honour again.
Two units of skirmishers this time.
Infantry skirmisher units can be fielded as units or broken down into four skirmish lines or supports. It can provide a skirmish line and three supports to one unit, a skirmish line to four units, etc.
Skirmish lines boost the attached unit's combat power but are lost on a 1D6 roll of 1-4 if the unit is in combat.
Support lines are simply reserve skirmish lines allowing an unengaged unit to replace a lost skirmish line.
As a result I have painted two complete units, eight skirmish lines and six support lines to cover all the permutations. Probably overkill but you never know.
The core units for a Roman Warlord force is a camp, a general, a veteran legion, two experienced legions and a unit of skirmishers so I can finally field the core force plus some extras.
Gauls next to provide some opposition.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/6476/aoBZod.jpg)
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/6030/DK3H58.jpg)
:-bd =D> :-bd
Looking good
Just catching up on this, really coming together well, looking forward to seeing the gallic opposition!
REALLY looking forward to the Chequered and Striped trews! SORRY...look fine... but my tiring eyes can only see a coloured 'blob'. However, MUCH better than a cardboard counter... so keep it up! :)