Hi
When playing a game do you visualize what is happening on the table in your own mind as if it was for real? I mean imagining what it would look like if the 12th Foot and Mouth (500 men strong, not 30 figures) was really trying to storm that redoubt. I don't mean all the time, just sometimes during a game. Or is it just me? ???
Cheers Paul
I sort of wish I saw it that way, but I'm afraid it's chess with prettier pieces for me.
I am the drummer boy beating the pas de charge. I am the panzer commander hunting the last surviving Sherman. I am the commander standing by his dead horse, broken sword in hand urging his men to one last push. I am the legionary, shoulder to shoulder with his comarades secure in his equipment, training and esprit de corps and contemptuous of the painted naked barbarians toiling up the hill towards the waiting volley of pila.
I am also the rifleman with the drummer boy, no older than his own son, in his sights. I am the Sherman's commander waiting for the panzer to crest the ridge and give him that split second opportunity to pump a shell through it's exposed belly. I am the pikeman who can't believe the enemy is willing to make one more effort and who is wondering if it's time to call it a day. I am the tribesman eager to get to grips with the hated Romans and avenge the deaths of friends and family.
As most of my games are 1-1 it happens all the time.
No it's not just you - I am pulled right in.
Generally not; unless I'm familiar with the rules and the figures and terrain are fairly convincing.
For exampleI've been roped in to play Saga, on a lovely table with exquisite figures.
However I spent the majority of the game poring over the small print on the battleboard, so missed most of the spectacle and any resulting immersion.
Not really for me. Maybe in the past with a skirmish game like Mordheim, but not these days with bigger battles.
Not really, at the start of the game I am often impressed by how it all looks.
But once the game starts it becomes much more of a tactical game to me (with pretty pieces) - but the overall look of the game has to fit what it is trying to represent.
I find that pieces take on a "personality" that develops during a game.
In my last Norman/Saxon game, the Norman Commander (Guy de Guy) failed a few dice rolls and ended up as a indecisive buffoon.
There is a Confederate cavalry commander who has comes straight from "Gone With the Wind", and is constantly shocked by the horrors of war.
I have a German Panzer commander who is full of vim in a Pz III in 1940 and charges at everything, but by 1944 realises the war is lost and is far more cautious with his Panther.
Nope, only after do I add the narrative.
I am not a Gamer.Apart from very limited stuff with teen friends, Long ago... I have always been solo... so can indulge MY imagination.
I 'Play With Toy Soldiers', rather than 'game' them. For ME it is ALL 'Visualisation'! Yes, some 'rules' may be involved for firing, movement, etc. But most 'events' are 'judgement' of possible effects with possibe outcomes subject to roll of a D6.
For instance:
Brit Armoured Car recce'ing a hedged lane. Panzerfaust. Do they see it first? D6 odds/evens. No. Fires... Firing tables from 'rules'.It's a 'miss'.
So, I AM IN THE TARGET... what 'might' happen?
Assign possible actons to a D6. 1: Sit like a plonker and return fire. There is a handy field gate... so crash through as 2... but... has it been Mined? (D6 for chances. D6 again for hitting such mine). 3, 4, 5... reverse fast. (But is driver experieced? Does he miss a gear or stall? Assign values to a D6). 6, tries to turn round! (Very unlikely.. so another D6... odds/evens. for panic stupid!). He does... so D6 odds/ evens for ending up in a ditch...
So ME , the Brit, is in the vehicle.
ME, The German:
Does he have a reload? Does he B****r Off, quick... Depends on situation, Unit, 'experience', orders... etc. ...
Earlier periods, with 'massed ' troops rely more heavily on 'Rules'... but not 'slavishly' so. If I am in the 'advancing Column' receiving a volley... 'rules', 'indicate' an outcome. BUT...Am I a green , scared Conscript or a war weary Vet who wants to get the job over with? DO I APPLY the Rules? Or throw in a 'variable'? Up to me! it's MY Fun.
But... it is NOT all just Fun. When YOU have modelled THAT Armoured Car...that Guy with a Panzerfaust...that infantry unit.. the blokes are YOUR blokes. YOU have, in effect, recruited, trained and worked WITH them. You don't want them to 'burn' or have their guts shot through their back. So... 'Visualisation' is MY 'bag' rather than 'Gaming'.
Each to their own! I 'play with toy soldiers'!
Quote from: Ithoriel on 11 July 2021, 03:25:44 PM
I am the drummer boy beating the pas de charge. I am the panzer commander hunting the last surviving Sherman. I am the commander standing by his dead horse, broken sword in hand urging his men to one last push. I am the legionary, shoulder to shoulder with his comarades secure in his equipment, training and esprit de corps and contemptuous of the painted naked barbarians toiling up the hill towards the waiting volley of pila.
I am also the rifleman with the drummer boy, no older than his own son, in his sights. I am the Sherman's commander waiting for the panzer to crest the ridge and give him that split second opportunity to pump a shell through it's exposed belly. I am the pikeman who can't believe the enemy is willing to make one more effort and who is wondering if it's time to call it a day. I am the tribesman eager to get to grips with the hated Romans and avenge the deaths of friends and family.
A stimulating read. Profound. Thanks for sharing.
Definitely an interesting read from all
I sometimes picture some of the situations mentioned by Ithoriel and other similar ones, in all cases I understand enough to be truly grateful that I am in none of them
I do tend to visualise myself as a one of the commanders of the forces I'm commanding, the admiral, the brigadier...
In a refight we did of the Maleme section of the German invasion of Crete I commanded the Fallschirmjäger Regiment that landed in Prison valley, my orders were to attack north out of the valley and cut the coast road. In doing so I had to push past Galatas but got so distracted by the Kiwi counter attack from there that I failed to cut the coast road allowing the Australians to move down the road and successfully recapture Maleme. A really interesting example of how easily commanders can make mistakes in battle
I didn't even have the excuse of parachuting into a tree, being mortared, shot at and fighting through the night that the command stand had experienced during the game
It's definitely you. I do visualise, but only when reading a book.
Quote from: Leman on 12 July 2021, 12:21:39 PM
It's definitely you. I do visualise, but only when reading a book.
One is visualising your own thoughts the other is visualising someone else's. I wonder if that makes a difference?
Tabletop games, board games, even some computer games, I'm visualising the actuality behind the mechanisms. Weaving a story out of the bald narrative.
And books and radio plays definitely have better visuals than films and TV programmes!
Quote from: Ithoriel on 12 July 2021, 01:43:28 PM
And books and radio plays definitely have better visuals than films and TV programmes!
Which is why Hitchhiker's worked so well as a book & radio show, and was truly terrible on the TV.
The BBC special effects budget will never compete with the graphics chip in your head.
Hear! Hear!
For me the "Lord of the Rings" is the Radio version with Ian Holm and Michael Horden. Got me through some bad times at uni.
Only problem with radio is having to describe everything "oh no! He's hanging on with just one hand! He's slipping!" *swanee whistle* *watermelon splat"
This is the weirdest thread for some time!
Prepare for more weirdness.
When I play real opponents it is simply a game without deep visualization. I do enjoy when a narrative emerges or some event seems "realistic" to my sensibilities. Most of the time I am too caught up in trying to win and not looking like an indecisive buffoon ( ;) ).
Ah, but when I play solo I hover above the battlespace like a capricious god, dispensing curses or favors upon any figure or unit that has momentarily caught my fancy. These curses and favors have no efficacy, however. They never alter the narrative the Fates spin out for me. Although capricious I am also remote. The outcome means nothing to me. I hear the sounds, see the flash of steel and smell the reeking smoke. I never ever see the blood and gore. I simple take notes.
I'd say I definitely build a narrative as I go and somewhat visualise the events unfolding. I don't necessarily see myself on the table but rather an observer of the unfolding events. I tend to think "what would this commander do?" rather than "what would I do?" It would still be fairly abstracted though, not as detailed a visual as many here.
I do mostly play solo though so that lets me get more info the narrative flow as I go. When playing others it's usually been teaching them or trying to get them into it, so more focused on what the most fun/interesting outcome is then add narrative later.
Quote from: John Cook on 12 July 2021, 08:29:20 PM
This is the weirdest thread for some time!
That's saying something in this forum!! :)
Quote from: Raider4 on 12 July 2021, 02:37:19 PM
Which is why Hitchhiker's worked so well as a book & radio show, and was truly terrible on the TV.
The BBC special effects budget will never compete with the graphics chip in your head.
This is SO true......Just gone through the whole H2G2 radio shows, while I've ben pushing putty.
As Nobby says...The Beeb's radio version of LOTR is a belter, too.
(Though that doesn't mean I didn't enjoy the films......even with the way they 'tweaked' the story in various places.)
Cheers - Phil. :)