As I've around 20 flags painted and ready to attach this weekend thought I'd ask what techniques others use?
I originally tried using PVA in the past but found it a bit thick and watering down smudged the paint.
Usually use superglue now, just have to work fast or risk sticking the flag to my finger and having to repaint!
Attach piece of paper around flagstaff or lance, same size as separate paper flag, using UHU. Fold a bit. Apply glue and stick the real flag onto it; now have four thicknesses of paper, three of glue, so it's fairly durable. Paint edges.
I use UHU power. I put some onto the blade of a small craft knife then smear it on one side of the flag.
The flag has been folded so I carefully fit it around the
pole and then use tweezers to compress it close to the pole
Fold the flag first - usually have a second go at folding to get the corners lined up >:(
Then use slightly diluted PVA to glue. I prefer this as it gives a chance to reposition.
Fold the flag artistically round a paint brush handle or similar to show it blowing in the wind!
When dry colour in the white cut edges - usually with an appropriate shade of wash, though depending on the paper paint may be better.
Interesting, I'm perhaps using too strong/fast a superglue, I usually use loctite max or something to that effect. May have a rummage in the box and see if I have any other types.
My current technique is quite close to Chad's.
I like the idea of the paper underneath for the initial attachment FK, may try that.
Fred, I did initially try a similar technique but ended up making a mess of it too many times. #-o
Quote from: fred. on 06 June 2020, 09:18:07 AM
Fold the flag first - usually have a second go at folding to get the corners lined up >:(
Then use slightly diluted PVA to glue. I prefer this as it gives a chance to reposition.
Fold the flag artistically round a paint brush handle or similar to show it blowing in the wind!
When dry colour in the white cut edges - usually with an appropriate shade of wash, though depending on the paper paint may be better.
Wot he said.
Ditto.
I've never had problems caused by the PVA on printed flags
+3
I either use commercially produced flags or print them from one of the sites on-line. In the case of commercially produced flags I often buy them in 28mm size, scan and re-size them, and print them myself, retaining the originals as masters. Once dried, say 24 hours, I cut them out, fold them round the staff to make sure the two sides match, then glue them with PVA glue. This moistens the paper and allows you to drape/fold it. Let them dry hard then paint the edges, otherwise the white of the paper will show. That's about it really. I too have never had any problem using PVA with printed flags as long as they are dry. The examples in the picture came from War Flags and were originally 28mm size, scanned, reduced and printed on an ordinary ink-jet printer.
Found a thinner superglue that seemed to work well.
Tried FKs trick for the cavalry though hadn't the patience to do it for all the infantry. Seems to have done well though.
I'll try PVA again in future. I maybe just watered it down too much when I tried.
Hello
I usually print them out on envelope label stationery so they are pre-sticky and I like to change flags to save painting up two regiments when one will do. :D
Cheers
GrumpyOldMan
Quote from: GrumpyOldMan on 06 June 2020, 07:58:21 PM
Hello
I usually print them out on envelope label stationery so they are pre-sticky and I like to change flags to save painting up two regiments when one will do. :D
Cheers
GrumpyOldMan
Interesting idea! I did try making swappable flags for my ECW stuff using glued flags, hadn't thought about using labels. I generally paint flags but will keep that in mind if doing more complex flags
Like most others I use PVA for 10mm flags and never had an issue with it running the ink of the flag designs.
FWIW my technique is as follows:
1. Design flags using MS Paint/GIMP (or ocassionally use commercial ones) and print onto good quality A4 paper at your printers highest print quality settings.
2. Carefullly cut out the flag using a very sharp craft knife and metal ruler.
3. Gently test fold the flag so that the two halves line up and make a crease along the base of the flag where it will attach to the flagpole/lance/spear/pike etc
4. Apply enough (but NOT too much) PVA to the first 1/3 of the two ends of the flag and gentily bring them together, lining up the two sides so that they evenly match and leave to dry for a few minutes.
5. Push the base of the flag open and apply enough PVA to stick the rest of the flag together and also apply some round the flagpole that it is going to be attached to.
6. Push the flagpole through the flag and gently press the two sides together until they wrap round the whole length of the pole. At this stage the flag should still be pilable enough to mold some folds into it to make it look like its moving in the wind.
7. Using appropriate colours paint or wash the white edges of the flag and use a matt varnish to seal the whole base.
Some Scots ECW command bases that I did recently to show the results:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49729758322_796333dcd1_c.jpg)
Looks well. My PVA experience tended to be it getting clumpy or squeezing out of the flag. May have just used too much and a slight water down would work well. One for experimenting.
Looking at your pictures makes me want to get my ECW out again. Just don't have the space to put up a big game at the moment. Someday soon hopefully.
I use a very similar approach to Pierre the Shy but like Fred I glue all the flag in one go but don't dilute my PVA
The keys are to fold the flag first and use a very thin smear of PVA on both sides
One interesting thing I learnt during my Hundred Years War banner research was that they used battens and other stiffening techniques to ensure the banner 'flew' square rather than flapping in the breeze
Fortunately I found that out before I had applied any banners #:-S
If I have suggested to anyone in the past that they should add a bit of movement to their medieval flags, my apologies :-[
In my 15mm and 28mm I use sticky address labels cut and folded round the flag pole, then paint the flag when I'm painting the figure.
Haven't tried the pre-printed 10mm flags yet....
Mark
Quote from: paulr on 06 June 2020, 10:14:15 PM
I use a very similar approach to Pierre the Shy but like Fred I glue all the flag in one go but don't dilute my PVA
The keys are to fold the flag first and use a very thin smear of PVA on both sides
One interesting thing I learnt during my Hundred Years War banner research was that they used battens and other stiffening techniques to ensure the banner 'flew' square rather than flapping in the breeze
Fortunately I found that out before I had applied any banners #:-S
If I have suggested to anyone in the past that they should add a bit of movement to their medieval flags, my apologies :-[
That bit about the battens is worth remembering
MMCV - I put a little blob on one side, then wet a finger and spread it around....
Can somebody slap Orcs on the back - I think he's swallowed his tongue...
Quote from: Orcs on 06 June 2020, 10:43:29 PM
That bit about the battens is worth remembering
Is that a batten used as an insert in the flag as with a sail or as a crossbar from which the flag is being hung?
I believe an insert as with a sail.
I first came across this when looking at the background to the Perry's Agincourt diorama
QuoteAs you can see the banners are all shown stiff, not fluttering. During this period banners (as opposed to standards) were silk stiffened with buckram (a treated linen/canvas) in the middle, like a sandwich, or had a wooden baton along the top edge so they didn't 'fly'.
https://royalarmouries.org/stories/behind-the-scenes/agincourt-battle-formation/ (https://royalarmouries.org/stories/behind-the-scenes/agincourt-battle-formation/)
I've come across a couple of other similar observations
I didn't know that about the banners, that's really interesting!
Thanks - new to me too. Do you know the start and end dates?
I've seen references to stiffened banners in both the 14th and 15th century but no specifics
Quote from: sultanbev on 06 June 2020, 10:36:11 PM
In my 15mm and 28mm I use sticky address labels cut and folded round the flag pole, then paint the flag when I'm painting the figure.
Haven't tried the pre-printed 10mm flags yet....
Mark
I hadn't thought of that. I'll try printing my flags onto a sticky label next time. I doubt I'd ever want to paint my own though and I just wonder how easy it will be with sticky labels, with PVA you can slide the two side into place if you don't get it quite right first time.
Quote from: Last Hussar on 06 June 2020, 11:03:58 PM
MMCV - I put a little blob on one side, then wet a finger and spread it around....
Can somebody slap Orcs on the back - I think he's swallowed his tongue...
Similar to what I do, except I apply the PVA with a brush. It is easy to remove any excess. I don't thin it, it is not necessary and it makes the paper too wet and difficult to handle.
Quote from: John Cook on 07 June 2020, 12:03:56 PM
I hadn't thought of that. I'll try printing my flags onto a sticky label next time. I doubt I'd ever want to paint my own though and I just wonder how easy it will be with sticky labels, with PVA you can slide the two side into place if you don't get it quite right first time.
No life is too short and my painting skills not really up to it. I try and avoid cast on flags where I can.