Hi All
You may have seen the battle report by Sunjester about or refight of Alamanza in 10mm.
One problem I had being the British and all troops in red was identifying which regiments were in the same brigade, particularly when some of the first brigade fell back through the second brigade.
What I need is an easy, aesthetically pleasing and NON FIDDLY way of identifying which troops belong to which brigade.
It needs to be :-
Versatile- so I can use it for a number of protagonists -
Able to attached the unit to it or vice versa - we did use counters but these can be ambiguous and you have to remember to move them with the unit
Relatively cheap as I will need lots.
Easy to make - as I need lots
I had thought of getting sabot bases made as movement trays and then marking the brigade number on the rear of the sabot. I dismissed this as with a 2mm deep base below the 2mm figure base I will end up with a base nearly half the height of the figure.
Has anyone else had this problem or worked out a solution.
Maybe something like having the same number of tufts on the base for units in the same brigade?
I saw this idea on the roll a one blog and thought it a good idea
I paint the edges of the bases of each major unit a different colour. I use red, white, blue, green, yellow, black for 1-6, then if I need to, mark the subunits by dots or lines on the back of the bases. So 2 dots on blue = 2nd Bttn, 3rd brigade (or more likely in my case 2nd section, 3rd platoon.)
If you don't like the bright colours, perhaps use various shades of brown/green?
For some Pacific War I used a mix of sand/static grass. 1st squad had grass on the left, 2nd on the right, 3rd at the rear, 4th at the back. Sounds awful, but you don't notice the effect overall, but you can quickly pick out your units "with the trained eye".
I label the back of bases, leave a strip, paint it white, either magnitude or blutak a label.
I use a back edge of the base approach for games which have standard number of bases. Colours are ochre, pale yellow, pale green, black and white e.g. third battalion of the first regiment in the first brigade of the second division of Prussian first corps will be from left to right pale green (regiment), black (division), ochre (corps). The pale green has three black dots (third battalion) and the black has one white dot (first brigade).
For my 20mm figures I use some of the 'flowers' from Noch; either for different brigades or regiments within brigades or divisions; red, white or yellow or even different shades of green. For my 10mm stuff I have up to now been able to use subtle differences in uniforms like cuffs, dress, equipment or tribal color preferences etc. to differentiate. An upcoming ACW project will make me have to reconsider this too though and I will probably do something in the basing system like the flowers or something similar.
Cheers,
Rob
All of my units' bases are painted a different colour underneath the base (obviously the same colour for each regiment/battalion). If brigades ever get intermingled, I can pick up a base, look underneath and refer to the brief note I made at the start of the game telling me which colours are in which brigades. Simples. :)
That's great until you realise the Prussians shuffled a lot of units post 1866 and 1870!
But they did keep the shoulder boards of their old Corps...
The other problem Orcs has is that we do not usually play with "standard" brigades/divisions. When refighting historical battles the orbats are different each time, so a permanent marker on the bases is not always going to help.
.... and that is why I have painted different colours out of sight on the bottom of the bases of each regiment or battalion (btw, these colours also often correspond with facing colours, saddle cloth colours or flags but not always). For example ...
In one game I can have Brigade 1 with 2 regiments or battalions - say, one with red underneath the base and the other with blue - and Brigade 2 with 4 units - one with green, one with yellow, one with white and one with black.
In another game, I could re-arrange the same 6 units in 2 Brigades, each with 3 units; Brigade 1 with red, blue and green coloured bottoms and Brigade 2 with yellow, white and black.
Simple and flexible. :)
I don't like labels except on ships. My solution for the British is to use the various different troop types, so a brigade of Highlanders, Fusiliers, etc. Also use the facing colours on the wrists, and Kings Colour. Totally historically inaccurate but it works.
French - use allies - so I have Hellvitains in red, and also different coloured great coats and shako covers.
IanS
Either a strip/space on the back where you can put a temporary label (small paper strip with "1st Brigade" blue tac'd down) or a marker - eg all units in Brigade 1 use a red tiny dice (suitable for marking hits, as well!), all in Brigade 2 use a tiny yellow dice etc. Or pop a dice frame/marker on a penny behind each unit, but that runs the risk of them getting left behind or mixed up... saves lifting up bases halfway thru a game, but that works too if you don't mind a bit of mental juggling like Westmarcher says.
Write details under the base.
I wouldn't go with something permanent to define brigades - brigades change too much between games. For bases within a unit then it works to have something distinct, but not for brigades.
I would probably go for either paint on the rear edge of the base, use 1 or 2 stripes and some different colours.
Or use something like sticky coloured dots on the rear edge, and wrapping to the bottom. These can be removed, or stuck over for the next game. If you want you could add numbers to the dots.
Quote from: toxicpixie on 11 October 2017, 11:20:14 AM
... saves lifting up bases halfway thru a game, but that works too if you don't mind a bit of mental juggling like Westmarcher says.
No mental juggling at all, Nathan - I write it down (remember, with Black Powder you have to make a note somewhere of the Commander's and of each unit's combat attributes, Brigade break point, etc. so when I'm preparing that before the game I just add the first initial of the colour beside the unit on the brigade roster). I find that you only have to lift bases if you intermingle brigades and cannot identify units which, in my experience, hardly ever happens (although would probably happen more if I was playing with Orcs :P ).
I know we all have our own preferences and maybe it's just me but most if not all of the other suggestions seem rather complicated to me and/or require a lot more work each time you start a new game.
Link to BP Army Roster:-
http://www.warlordgames.com/now-available-free-black-powder-playsheet/ (http://www.warlordgames.com/now-available-free-black-powder-playsheet/)
Yes, if you're referring back to an army list it's no great mental hassle. At least until the third lubricating beverage goes down and brigades end up hopelessly intermingled, but there's probably no hope by then whatever you've chosen ;)
I think there are two distinct situations here, giving rise to whether or not to permanently mark. Most of the games I play with my 10mm figures in the FPW have fixed unit sizes. Permanently marking the base is not a problem. In the SYW I also use units of a fixed size, identified by flags and cuffs/lapels etc. However in 6mm FPW, when I am doing BBB and unit size can vary from battle to battle I attach a small label to the command stand along the lines of 5/T, i.e. the unit started with 5 bases and is trained so will be spent when it drops to three bases.
I like that approach, Leman - anything that makes it obvious from a glance is good. I don't mind the record sheet > hidden mark approach but it's nice to see at a glance.
The brigades the units are in will vary from game to game, so I need something that is a temporary marker
Hello
For temporary markers I use envelope labels. You can write the details on one end, fokd ovet to make a tab and use the sticky part onto the underneath of the base. This leaves a tab sticking out from the rear of the base with the required info. I hope I've described it ok. If not I'll take a photo.
Cheers
GrumpyOldMan
I regularly print markers for my units. If all you want is to differentiate Brigades, I would recommend a simple piece of coloured card, glued with PvA to the underside of the base, with enough protruding for you to distinguish between Brigades.
Mollinary
Quote from: GrumpyOldMan on 11 October 2017, 08:58:31 PM
Hello
For temporary markers I use envelope labels. You can write the details on one end, fokd ovet to make a tab and use the sticky part onto the underneath of the base. This leaves a tab sticking out from the rear of the base with the required info. I hope I've described it ok. If not I'll take a photo.
Cheers
GrumpyOldMan
No that's perfectly clear thanks
Quote from: mollinary on 11 October 2017, 09:22:43 PM
I regularly print markers for my units. If all you want is to differentiate Brigades, I would recommend a simple piece of coloured card, glued with PvA to the underside of the base, with enough protruding for you to distinguish between Brigades.
Mollinary
Sorry that won't work as they are not in the same brigade every game
Quote from: Orcs on 11 October 2017, 09:50:43 PM
Sorry that won't work as they are not in the same brigade every game
Well, I would respectfully disagree. The bits of card cost peanuts, and you can replace them after any battle. Simplicity trumps minimal costs anytime for me.
Best,
Mollinary
Use blue tack instead of PVA and you can juggle the labels / coloured cards around
I presume the dab of PVA is small enough you can just pull the tab off? Then you can add another in a different colour/marking for the next game etc.
I'd be tempted to pop a little sticker somewhere visible but unobtrusive on the base.
Orcs asked for advice, loads has now been given. Take your pick.
But there's only shovels
And his favourite tune is Ace of Spades. I saw that one coming, he said, hammering the point home. Or as the chainsaw said, don't get me started.
Coat!
Quote from: toxicpixie on 12 October 2017, 08:03:43 AM
I presume the dab of PVA is small enough you can just pull the tab off? Then you can add another in a different colour/marking for the next game etc.
I'd be tempted to pop a little sticker somewhere visible but unobtrusive on the base.
Absolutely!
Mollinary
I should probably get duff PVA for that (copydex or pritstick maybe?), as my industrial sized tub of builders grade PVA is probably a bit overly strong :D
Also, I'm not going to dig into the fertile soil of agricultural based implement jokes, you couldn't drag me to that with a tractor.
Quote from: toxicpixie on 12 October 2017, 09:28:28 AM
Also, I'm not going to dig into the fertile soil of agricultural based implement jokes, you couldn't drag me to that with a tractor.
Hoe! Hoe! Hoe! ;)