We're over halfway through 2015 and with the improved release schedule so far this year, it's about time we updated the Top 10 Requests!
Top 10 Ranges:
1. Indian Mutiny
2. Yom Kippur
3. Modern Infantry
4. War of 1812
5. Aztecs
6. 1860 Italian revamp
7. Korean War
8. 1920's/1930's Gangsters
9. Boxer Rebellion
10. Naps in India - NEW ENTRY!
We've not made much progress on the top ranges so far this year with our designers focussed on other things, so there's only a couple of minor changes to this list. The Gangsters have dropped down several places as the ranges around them have picked up more interest. Down the bottom, the Fantasy Bears have dropped out of the Top 10 and the Naps in India requests have jumped back up and into the chart. Once we've got the next few Naps ranges sculpted, along with some more WWI additions, we might try and get the Indian Mutiny lot sorted out, as they've been holding that top spot for quite some time now!
And, Top 10 Items:
1. Werewolves
2. WWII Italian Artillery
3. 1870's Marching Band
4. AWI Wagons/Carts
5. SYW Ottoman's
6. Modern Police - NEW ENTRY!
7. WWII Russian 37mm AA
8. T-35
9. Armoured Mongols - NEW ENTRY!
10. Vietnam Radio Op's
As above, there's not a lot of changes to this list but we do have a couple of new entries in the form of Modern Police and the Armoured Mongols! Work on these items has also been slow, but there is some good news to come. The Werewolves will be appearing as part of the Warband extension hopefully, and we'll have see what we can do about getting the AWI carts and wagons done too. Elsewhere, we're slowly making progress on the Italian artillery, with the Brixia 45mm now available in the SCW range and some new WWII Italian crew sitting in Pendraken HQ.
For anyone wanting to compare this list to the previous one, it can be found here: http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,11244.0.html (http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,11244.0.html)
We'll keep tracking the votes and we'll do our best to make some more progress on these over the coming 6 months or so!
:D
You have been busy this morning ;)
Please DELETE no 5 immediately, and STOP SWEARING :d :d
IanS
What's wrong with SYW Ottomans?
Ian just has this nervous condition.
Quote from: mad lemmey on 27 August 2015, 07:08:05 AM
What's wrong with SYW Ottomans?
Frightfully uncomfortable your Ottoman. Especially if not properly stuffed.
I've just looked at the top 10 ranges, and there's only two that I wouldn't HAVE to buy.
:'( I'm never going to have any money :'(
Oooh! T35! Pretty!
SYW Ottomoans would be lovely to have. Sad to see no sign of WWII Polish though in the list :(.
We ought to make another list from those above......
Which ones are most worth the designers' time, and Leon's money to produce. ;)
I know which one I'd put at the bottom from list one. :D :P
Cheers - Phil
THe A word. I suspect a certain Kitty has several ID's and is packing the list....... :'( :'( :'(
IanS
Quote from: Techno on 27 August 2015, 10:01:17 AM
We ought to make another list from those above......
Which ones are most worth the designers' time, and Leon's money to produce. ;)
I know which one I'd put at the bottom from list one. :D :P
Cheers - Phil
Quite right.
As I have said before I wonder how much the order of developement would change if it were based on people pre- ordering and paying for the ones they want.
Like the Mongols but pay with the pledge.
Are Gangsters actually a viable range?
Surely people would only buy one or two of each figure to make up thier Gang.
Each gang would only be perhaps 20 figues with at least a couple of personality figures. Even if each person interested in the range bought 5 gangs of 20 figures thats an awful lot of masters ( and expense) to sell less than an army pack to interested parties.
Quote from: fsn on 27 August 2015, 07:20:12 AM
I've just looked at the top 10 ranges, and there's only two that I wouldn't HAVE to buy.
:'( I'm never going to have any money :'(
Oooh! T35! Pretty!
Look FSN if you cut your sessions wit Miss Whiplash down to 2 a week, and you stopped asking her to do that "SPECIAL THING" :o you like you would be able to afford them all ;D
Quote from: Just a few Orcs on 27 August 2015, 11:28:52 AM
Are Gangsters actually a viable range?
Surely people would only buy one or two of each figure to make up thier Gang.
Each gang would only be perhaps 20 figues with at least a couple of personality figures. Even if each person interested in the range bought 5 gangs of 20 figures thats an awful lot of masters ( and expense) to sell less than an army pack to interested parties.
Have to agree. Good idea, but like Wild West; needs characters, not regiments.
As some of you know I have a bee in my bonnet about the wargames industry being commercially viable, as I want the manufacturers to:-
a : Be viable finacially so they can actually earn a living without working stupid hours or living on bread and dripping
b: being financially viable means they will still be there when you want to add to a range or change period
While is easy for us to request stuff and we all want everything for our favourite periods, perhaps we should be mindful before we ask of the commercial viability of that item / range.
Obviously its up to Dave and Leon to work this out, but when a new range comes out you can hear the groans of
" They havent produced a Negro trooper with a wooden leg for the ACW range that I asked for 25 times". When said person is asked how many of said figure they want they inevitably say " Oh at least 3 "
Looking at the list of Items Top 10 Items, A couple of points spring to mind:-
3. 1870's Marching Band
This is not my period, but how generic is this amounst the various protagonists / nations of the time? Again looks like a lot of masters for relatively low volume sales?
7. WWII Russian 37mm AA
In 10mm surely the Bofors it was based on with a Russian crew would be close enough?
8. T-35
I accept this was an "iconic" tank of the 1930's and they were actually used. BUT I game ealry war in 10mm and even allowing for my meglomainia and future expansion into the far east theatre I will only ever have a platoon . They only bult 61, so how many are actually going to get bought?
6. Modern Police - NEW ENTRY!
Again like the gangsters this looks more like a skirmish range, with correspondingly low volumes for production cost.
The other items on the list have multiple uses and /or look like they will sell in reasonable volume
1. Werewolves
2. WWII Italian Artillery
3. 1870's Marching Band
4. AWI Wagons/Carts
5. SYW Ottoman's
6. Modern Police - NEW ENTRY!
7. WWII Russian 37mm AA
8. T-35
9. Armoured Mongols - NEW ENTRY!
10. Vietnam Radio Op's
Quote from: Just a few Orcs on 27 August 2015, 11:31:57 AM
Look FSN if you cut your sessions wit Miss Whiplash down to 2 a week, and you stopped asking her to do that "SPECIAL THING" :o you like you would be able to afford them all ;D
Funny thing, at first I thought she was an ice cream seller and asked for a 99.
Quote from: fsn on 27 August 2015, 12:11:53 PM
Funny thing, at first I thought she was an ice cream seller and asked for a 99.
I bet THAT made your eyes water!! ;D ;D
Quote from: Just a few Orcs on 27 August 2015, 11:54:28 AM
As some of you know I have a bee in my bonnet about the wargames industry being commercially viable, as I want the manufacturers to:-
a : Be viable finacially so they can actually earn a living without working stupid hours or living on bread and dripping
b: being financially viable means they will still be there when you want to add to a range or change period
etc
Friend Orcs make a number of good points.
When one reviews the Pendraken catalogue, there are a lot of ranges, with a lot of figures. Castings an objective eye over the list, I would say (and here we release the feline amongst the avian) that the what I would consider to me "mainstay" periods that Pendraken are missing or light in are:
- Chariots armies: Ancient Egyptians and their foes
- Ancient Chinese
- Napoleonics: The British range is excellent, but no Prussians or Spaniards?
- Post WWII:
Then there are the odd omissions like Byzantines, Huns, ... and I'm sure you have your own to add to the list. And I'm sure that if Pendaken produce Han Chinese then someone will want Sung, and if Pendraken produce chickens, someone will cry "fowl".
We all have our pet wants - I may have mentioned that I'd like some superheroes - but what would we buy in large numbers, as well as attracting new customers to the right path?
Remember that there are two makers of chariot armies already, thus competition; and one of them is planning to go the ancient Chinese route in time for Christmas.
Indeed so, but they're not Pendraken.
It highlights the difficulties in the decision making process. I'm sure there are many hours spent in the Pendraken bunker scratching each others heads ... but that's just Middlesborough for you
It's a balancing act. The ranges I have highlighted are probably well covered elsewhere. The less obvious ranges are likely to yield fewer sales so overheads are proportionately larger.
I'm certain that somewhere there is a marketing guru who could make it all very simple for an exorbitant price.
Glad all I have to do is buy 'em.
My take on it, is that Dave gets made what he thinks is cool, if someone else wants them its a bonus :D (I really hope it is like that :))
With any new range/item, there's always a lot to consider and very often a lot of compromise involved. You can break them down into three categories:
- Long term: Like the Napoleonics or the Ancients, we set out to do a huge amount of stuff, but it will take several years to complete. It's never a quick fix, but we do keep plugging away at it. Sometimes we have to give the sculptors a break, either because they're tired of shakos and epaulettes or because we need to prioritise something else for a while. This happened with the Naps (moved onto some WWII French for a break) and the Ancients (moved onto the Warband expansion). We'll come back to those long-term projects as soon as we can.
- Short term: These are the quick ranges, like the WWII French or the Mongols, where we can take 3 months or so to knock out all the sculpts needed and then we go back to the other projects. Ranges on the list that would come under this category would be the 1860 Italians or the Indian Mutiny.
- Quick fix: This would be anything that only requires a handful of figures and can be done within a months batch of sculpts. These get fitted in here and there, sometimes where a sculptor has got a bit of a gap in his monthly budget, other times where we've not quite prepped the next larger job for them. Sometimes we'll also have a full month's worth of smaller items, just to tick some off the requests lists.
Just to run through the lists:
1. Indian Mutiny - Short term project, could be done in 3 months or so.
2. Yom Kippur - Same as above.
3. Modern Infantry - Bit longer project, 6 months or so, but we're waiting until we've got more vehicles done.
4. War of 1812 - Will come as part of the larger Naps project.
5. Aztecs - We're looking at doing these here and there when we have a gap.
6. 1860 Italian revamp - Short term project, 3 months.
7. Korean War - Short term project, 3 months.
8. 1920's/1930's Gangsters - Unfortunately an unlikely one to appear any time soon. As people have said, it's not the most viable range to look at producing, so we'll have to wait and see.
9. Boxer Rebellion - Short term project, 3 months.
10. Naps in India - As with 1812, this will come as part of the Naps expansion.
1. Werewolves - These will be done as part of the Warband expansion.
2. WWII Italian Artillery - Working on these at the moment, we've got the crews done so we just need some more artillery pieces.
3. 1870's Marching Band - Not sure on these, we might be able to do 4 or 5 figures one month, but the sales of them will be limited.
4. AWI Wagons/Carts - Need to wait until the vehicle guys have got a spare month and we can get a few wagons done. We do want to do these as they always sell well.
5. SYW Ottoman's - Not sure on when this one might appear, but we do want to do it.
6. Modern Police - Wouldn't be more than a handful of figures, probably when we come to the rest of the modern infantry.
7. WWII Russian 37mm AA - I'll have a check, but I think this may be on one of the design schedules somewhere.
8. T-35 - Not on the radar just yet, the vehicle designers have got quite a lot on at the moment.
9. Armoured Mongols - This is one of the easier ones, we just need to send a set of the current Heavy Cav masters down to Phil and he can convert those.
10. Vietnam Radio Op's - Again, an easy one to do, and we'll probably fit it in with a larger batch of new Vietnam figures from further down the requests lists.
As to the viability of a lot of them, that always a decision we have to make, but we are in a favourable position when it comes to that. We've got wide ranges that sell well consistently, so we've got a bit of leeway when it comes to the 'novelty' items in some areas. We might not sell loads of 19th C. marching bands, but we always find that people will buy them for the fun factor, just to paint them up and stick them on the table as a little vignette, or put them on a command base, etc. We probably won't recoup the sculpting costs, but I think things like that make the range stand out a little from the crowd.
Quote from: Matt of Munslow on 27 August 2015, 04:00:52 PM
My take on it, is that Dave gets made what he thinks is cool, if someone else wants them its a bonus :D
And that is what we call the X Factor, as there are occasions when this does indeed happen... #-o
Indian mutiny, would be great :D :D :D :D
Quote from: MR T on 27 August 2015, 08:31:03 PM
Indian mutiny, would be great :D :D :D :D
This would have to include Flashman figures! Cowering behind bush, riding for the horizon,
en flagrante.
Leon,
Indian Mutiny in a 3 month schedule? Not as long term as Napoleonics it is but 3 months? Possible it depends on the number of codes you have in mind - potentially it is a much bigger range than say the 1860 Italians even allowing for the bolt on from the 1860s Canadian militia as troops in home service uniform. Much of course depends on the initial scoping of the project - worth looking at the various 28mm ranges of Mutiny figures that have come out in recent years - they have the same core figures but each has its own slant. For the real trainspotter range look at what Empress are doing with their 28mm range which is being mentored by Mike Snook.
Boxer Rebellion could be a short term project - some codes from other ranges (eg from the Boer War, Russo-Japanese War) could be pulled into provide the European armies but potentially the Chinese codes could be numerous. The devil lies in the detail of how the thing is scoped out.
Gobsmacked to see a T35 on the list - does anyone apart from China have enough metal to be able to cast one up? I shudder to think what the postage cost would be! Would it work in resin with metal turrets?
I notice that the French Revolutionary War has not made a separate appearance or do you consider it a part of a greater Napoleonic project?
Quote from: Bill Braham on 28 August 2015, 12:28:21 AM
Indian Mutiny in a 3 month schedule?
I'll have to dig out some notes I made on it a while back, but I think it was around the 3-month mark, maybe a little more. Half a dozen codes for the Indians, same for the Brits and then a handful of cavalry or thereabouts. We've already got a few sculpts in the drawer here at Pendraken HQ as well.
Quote from: Bill Braham on 28 August 2015, 12:28:21 AM
I notice that the French Revolutionary War has not made a separate appearance or do you consider it a part of a greater Napoleonic project?
The revolutionary ranges are constantly hovering in and out of the Top 10, but they are up there. They wouldn't be done as part of the Naps project though, as all of the major requestees have asked that the range be done by Clib, so we'll need to finish up some of the LoA, AWI additions first, and I'd also like to get the Late Roman opponents done before we head off in a completely new direction.
8)
The French Revolution is sadly neglected by almost all manufacturers in any scale. There are opportunities for games ranging from small skirmishes to good size battles involving the armies of several nationalities covering a period of almost 10 years. Never quite understood the fascination with 1809 compared to 1805-1807, 1813 or 1814.
Personally I have never seen a wargame that included a marching band in any period and find it difficult to understand why time and effort would be put into something like that when there is clearly a need to revamp/expand existing ranges where there is a greater sales potential.
Chad
Glad to see #3, Modern Infantry.
Really, really, really need/want Cold War Soviets, and/or their East German allies, since there are none to go with all the current Soviet/Russian vehicles you have for sale already, which are suitable for the 1950s - 1980s.
Argentine troops can pass for very early West Germans - late 1950s, though I'd like to see more modern West Germans produced as well - the early troops were equipped with the M48 and M113s you already sell, though I'd love to see HS-30s, Spz Kurz, Jagdpanzers, and eventually Leopards and Marders too.
US troops and vehicles from Vietnam can be used in Western Europe as well, as is, though I'd kill for some nice M60A1s, M114 scout vehicles, M551s, and M59 APCs to go along with all the other modern US armor you already produce. We also need some 3.5" bazookas, 106mm recoilless rifles, and M151 Mutt jeeps too.
Would it be intended that modern would include Bush Wars or is that a seperate range?
There is curremtly great interest in this era in both 20 and 28mm with some great figures and behicles being produced.
However, there should be interest in figures and vehicles for large scale actions in southern Africa.
Alan
And it's not like you already have the talibans done. ;)
And some Special forces too...
How about napoleonic casualties. Gap in the market across most miniature ranges. Good for game mechanic markers and scenic additions to bases and terrain. Not a sculpter but a little play with the Awi ones would give the required result
Naps casualties is definitely something we'll be getting to, probably after we've fleshed out the French range a bit.
Quote from: Chad on 30 August 2015, 07:20:44 AM
Personally I have never seen a wargame that included a marching band
One of the guys at the club has one for each of his ACW armies in 15mm
Quote from: Bill Braham on 28 August 2015, 12:28:21 AM
Gobsmacked to see a T35 on the list - does anyone apart from China have enough metal to be able to cast one up? I shudder to think what the postage cost would be! Would it work in resin with metal turrets?
Somebody does - I picked up a white metal T35 in 20mm off ebay a week or so ago. Weighs a ton
Quote from: Bill Braham on 28 August 2015, 12:28:21 AM
Gobsmacked to see a T35 on the list - does anyone apart from China have enough metal to be able to cast one up? I shudder to think what the postage cost would be! Would it work in resin with metal turrets?
Overall, a T35 probably isn't that much bigger than say, a Centurion. It was a big tank (9.7m x 3.2m x 3.4m) as compared to a Cent at 7.6m x 3.4m x 3.0m, but possibly because of the big turret, the Cent
feels bigger.
Anyway. Someone else does the T35 - FSN :(
Leon good to hear about naps casualties and the other intended additions. The whole financially viable issue must be a real conundrum/gamble for you guys. don't envy the decision making process at all (do like seeing the results though)
Quote from: Dave C on 10 November 2015, 10:23:50 PM
The whole financially viable issue must be a real conundrum/gamble for you guys. don't envy the decision making process at all (do like seeing the results though)
It can be interesting at times, but the bigger sellers usually prop up anything that's not as popular.
I'd be interested to know whether the casualty figures are commercially successful or not.
To me 10mm means more troops per base and still cheaper than 15mm. But I don't want to remove bases as casualties. I also don't want chits, dice or bits of paper to record losses and unit status. Therefore casualty figures become essential.
As a matter of interest I have in the past purchased one or two items from Redline. They are not as good as Pendraken but the proprietor sends some nice casualties figures as extras in each order. Every time I try to contact them to order some separately there is no reply, I think they are as a company wobbling.
:) Rob
Quote from: Rob on 12 November 2015, 01:39:12 PM
As a matter of interest I have in the past purchased one or two items from Redline. They are not as good as Pendraken but the proprietor sends some nice casualties figures as extras in each order. Every time I try to contact them to order some separately there is no reply, I think they are as a company wobbling.
:) Rob
They also produce the basics of a very nice ww2 Polish Range. I ordered some to mix in with those I have and they are very nice.
Quote from: Rob on 12 November 2015, 01:39:12 PM
I'd be interested to know whether the casualty figures are commercially successful or not.
Casualties are usually OK, being just a single sculpt and a mould, so if we can shift 30-40 packs of them then we've probably covered basic costs.
Waiting on ..............................
XX. Panther (new model)
XX. Tiger (new model)
4. AWI Wagons/Carts
10. Vietnam Radio Op's
Hopefully wont have to wait a year :)
So any update on the Indian Mutiny project since August? Is it still feasible as a 3 month project, and maybe do-able this year?
Quote from: Dazza on 16 November 2015, 08:48:50 PM
Waiting on ..............................
XX. Panther (new model)
XX. Tiger (new model)
<snippety snip>
Tiger is definitely done. I got one just before Christmas. Ordered a Tiger, asked for the new model if available as I wanted something distinctive to act as "mothership" for one of my Goliaths.
Now, of course, I want to upgrade my existing Tigers to the new model too. Damn you Pendraken and your clever marketing! ;)
I hope the Panthers barrel is better than the last one, most of my Panthers have broken barrels
Quote from: Dazza on 31 January 2016, 01:07:03 PM
I hope the Panthers barrel is better than the last one, most of my Panthers have broken barrels
The Tiger is, by design, chunkier than it's predecessor so the barrel is correspondingly more robust.
I assume the Panther will be the same.
That said my Panther's barrels have been fine - possibly because they don't survive long enough on table to receive much handling!
Quote from: Dazza on 16 November 2015, 08:48:50 PM
XX. Panther (new model)
XX. Tiger (new model)
As Ithoriel says, the Tiger is done and moulded, so we'll be announcing that one soon. The Panther will follow on shortly after as well.
The others haven't hit any sculptor schedules yet, so I wouldn't expect to those anytime soon.
Quote from: mike40k on 31 January 2016, 05:39:30 AM
So any update on the Indian Mutiny project since August? Is it still feasible as a 3 month project, and maybe do-able this year?
Possibly is probably the best answer there. We've got the sculptor working on the Naps Brunswickers at the moment and then I think we might put him onto the Polish as well. Once those are done we'll be giving him something else, to tick something off our lists and maintain his sanity in equal measure. It could be the Indian Mutiny, or it might be a remodel of some of the late 19th C. ranges, not sure yet.
I would be interested in an Aztec range.
And SYW Ottomans might be interesting to add to my Renaissance force. But... what are Ottomans doing in SYW? From a brief investigation I found that the Ottoman Empire was about the only European power that stayed out of this war.
Quote from: BucketKnight on 27 April 2016, 10:20:29 AM
I would be interested in an Aztec range.
Gentlemen, I like this man. Make him welcome. :)