Pendraken Miniatures Forum

Pendraken Rules! => Warband => Topic started by: Ironduke on 24 March 2015, 03:04:44 PM

Title: Warband historical
Post by: Ironduke on 24 March 2015, 03:04:44 PM
Do you guys think, especially Luddite, that these rules would lend themselves to historic, I could publish army lists in the ezine
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Luddite on 24 March 2015, 03:26:31 PM
What I would say is...they certainly do.

A historical version may be under development at the moment.   :-/

Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bodvoc on 24 March 2015, 03:36:35 PM
QuoteA historical version may be under development at the moment.

That would be fun, need any playtesters?
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Ironduke on 24 March 2015, 03:48:37 PM
Ooo yes I'll playtest, and if it's in production I won't harp on about army lists in the ezine, don't wanna give the game away ;)
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: jchaos79 on 24 March 2015, 11:31:11 PM
That is pretty interesting
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: getagrip on 24 March 2015, 11:46:53 PM
Be interesting to see if it "translates "  :-\
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: barbarian on 25 March 2015, 08:28:42 AM
The big work would be the lists, not the rules.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: getagrip on 25 March 2015, 08:36:30 AM
Quote from: barbarian on 25 March 2015, 08:28:42 AM
The big work would be the lists, not the rules.

Agree with that.  Fantasy lists usually need "toning down" for historical.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bodvoc on 25 March 2015, 10:41:51 AM
If the focus was on doing lists for the historical ancient armies covered by the Pendraken Ranges first, it would not take too long and I am sure plenty of people would be keen to help. The Pendraken ranges seem to cover many of the most popular ancient armies such as Greeks so if you did an Early Hoplite Armylist, with options to turn it into a full Early Spartan armylist for example, it is all on one page hopefully.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Chieftain on 25 March 2015, 10:55:50 AM
What armies would you like to see included as a basis?

Would 'Rome and her enemies' be a good start?

Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Ironduke on 25 March 2015, 10:59:53 AM
Perfect! Early imperials would be chippa, he says wiping drool from his chin
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: getagrip on 25 March 2015, 11:19:26 AM
Quote from: Chieftain on 25 March 2015, 10:55:50 AM
What armies would you like to see included as a basis?

Would 'Rome and her enemies' be a good start?



Awesome.  From the few bat reps I've seen, it looks as though the Warband mechanics would suit that period rather well :-\
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: cbr3d.com on 25 March 2015, 11:23:11 AM
Quote from: Chieftain on 25 March 2015, 10:55:50 AM
What armies would you like to see included as a basis?

Would 'Rome and her enemies' be a good start?



'Rome and her enemies' would be brilliant, possibly followed by 'Dark Ages'.   :D
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Ironduke on 25 March 2015, 11:46:59 AM
Quote from: Fig.ht on 25 March 2015, 11:23:11 AM
'Rome and her enemies' would be brilliant, possibly followed by 'Dark Ages'.   :D
Ooo yes dark ages, I've got viking and Saxon armies on my bench
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bodvoc on 25 March 2015, 12:03:08 PM
Rome and her enemies, the Dark Ages from the end of the Roman Empire up to 1066, but maybe only doing the armies with most appeal and having in a points system where players who want to cover the less popular armies can easily produce their own lists. Greek and Persian Wars would also be a favourite.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: FierceKitty on 25 March 2015, 12:45:41 PM
God, I'm depressed.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: cbr3d.com on 25 March 2015, 12:47:12 PM
Quote from: FierceKitty on 25 March 2015, 12:45:41 PM
God, I'm depressed.

What's up FK? 
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Duke Speedy of Leighton on 25 March 2015, 12:47:44 PM
You okay?
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: getagrip on 25 March 2015, 12:51:19 PM
Quote from: FierceKitty on 25 March 2015, 12:45:41 PM
God, I'm depressed.

:(  Not like you; everything okay?
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Matt J on 25 March 2015, 12:58:29 PM
I think FK doubts the ability of Warband to correctly demonstrate the effectiveness of the Triplex Acies system, amongst others  ;)
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: FierceKitty on 25 March 2015, 01:16:10 PM
I feel rather embarrassed (and touched). I'm fine, everyone. It's just the feeling that new ranges are doomed to be defeated by the need to produce reliable sellers that gets me down.

Thanks for the expressions of concern, and sorry I alarmed people.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Ironduke on 25 March 2015, 01:39:09 PM
I've got a dogs of war army Id like to apply to WB are there rules for pike in the book, mines in the post
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Ironduke on 25 March 2015, 01:41:13 PM
Quote from: FierceKitty on 25 March 2015, 01:16:10 PM
I feel rather embarrassed (and touched). I'm fine, everyone. It's just the feeling that new ranges are doomed to be defeated by the need to produce reliable sellers that gets me down.

Thanks for the expressions of concern, and sorry I alarmed people.

There's a law against touching without consent
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Luddite on 25 March 2015, 02:04:49 PM
Quote from: Ironduke on 25 March 2015, 01:39:09 PM
I've got a dogs of war army Id like to apply to WB are there rules for pike in the book, mines in the post

http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,11627.0.html (http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,11627.0.html)
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Duke Speedy of Leighton on 25 March 2015, 05:25:18 PM
I know we are all grammarless oiks FK, but you're a good man!
Glad your okay.  :D
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: AndyT on 25 March 2015, 09:12:09 PM
So if Warband Historical is on the cards I may as well sell my three volumes of Warmaster Ancients/Medieval whilst they are going for a good price and fund another Warband army  8)
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Leon on 25 March 2015, 09:42:37 PM
Quote from: AndyT on 25 March 2015, 09:12:09 PM
So if Warband Historical is on the cards I may as well sell my three volumes of Warmaster Ancients/Medieval whilst they are going for a good price and fund another Warband army  8)


We're talking quite a way down the line here, so there won't be a historical set being released in the near future.  We need to get the BKC family up and running first, so a Warband historical version would likely be a 2016 release I'd think.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: AndyT on 25 March 2015, 09:49:52 PM
That gives me time to paint the Macedonian army I bought several years ago then  :)
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Westmarcher on 25 March 2015, 10:52:36 PM
Quote from: Ironduke on 25 March 2015, 01:39:09 PM
I've got a dogs of war army Id like to apply to WB are there rules for pike in the book, mines in the post

:o  :o

There's a rule for posting mines?

And a particularly vicious fresh water fish?
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Leon on 26 March 2015, 12:57:56 AM
Quote from: AndyT on 25 March 2015, 09:49:52 PM
That gives me time to paint the Macedonian army I bought several years ago then  :)

:D
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Techno on 26 March 2015, 05:33:33 AM
Quote from: Westmarcher on 25 March 2015, 10:52:36 PM
There's a rule for posting mines?

Of course there is, you muppet !
The Post Office gets terribly sniffy if you try and send those through the mail !
Think what they were like with paints until recently.  ;)

Cheers - Phil

(I dunno.....Some people...I despair.)
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: AndyT on 05 April 2015, 08:01:52 PM
Quote from: Leon on 25 March 2015, 09:42:37 PM
We're talking quite a way down the line here, so there won't be a historical set being released in the near future.  We need to get the BKC family up and running first, so a Warband historical version would likely be a 2016 release I'd think.

Well I went ahead and sold my Warmaster Ancient Armies and Medieval books. Didn't bother selling the actual Warmaster Ancient rulebook as some of the pages were starting to come loose but I was very pleased to make £67 selling the two army lists books. That is going straight into the new Warband armies fund  :)
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bloodaxe on 05 April 2015, 09:38:45 PM
Would Historical armies be able to fight Fantasy armies? If so, how would Magic be handled? I have a few Warmaster Historical/Ancients books.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Roxxy on 30 April 2015, 10:31:15 AM
Hi all having had aprox 3-4 games of warband Fantasy the club is impressed and we now have 4 regular players, im converted love the way it flows and plenty to think about or gamble on. Thanks guys. However as soon as i started playing i thought HISTORICAL? If you need play testers im in, and so is my wife.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Luddite on 30 April 2015, 03:31:49 PM
Quote from: Roxxy on 30 April 2015, 10:31:15 AM
Hi all having had aprox 3-4 games of warband Fantasy the club is impressed and we now have 4 regular players, im converted love the way it flows and plenty to think about or gamble on. Thanks guys.

:D :-bd
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Leman on 01 May 2015, 08:07:11 AM
I am putting off painting up my Romans until the historical comes out.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: stenicplus on 01 May 2015, 09:17:45 AM
Quote from: Leman on 01 May 2015, 08:07:11 AM
I am putting off painting up my Romans until the historical comes out.

Why wait? Procrastinating will only mean they go to the bottom of the paint pile ;D

I think if you take out exotic units then you could find historical equivalents. Special attributes can then be used to tailor units.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Luddite on 01 May 2015, 10:39:02 AM
How would the Roman 'maniple' special rule work in Warband?
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Leman on 01 May 2015, 10:41:21 AM
Your question explains why a historical version is needed. It might work similarly to Impetus, another big base set.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bodvoc on 01 May 2015, 12:32:01 PM
QuoteHow would the Roman 'maniple' special rule work in Warband?

In your turn, supporting units of legionaries (within 1BW) that are not currently engaged in melee may replace legionary units that are 'Locked'in melee, thus replacing tired units with fresh ones?
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: stenicplus on 02 May 2015, 11:05:19 PM
How many other rule sets reproduce the maniple? Most subsume it into the mechanics don't they? I suppose it depends very much at what level it's to be pitched but not sure I recall even Warmaster Ancients allowing for figures to be rotated.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: FierceKitty on 03 May 2015, 12:12:34 AM
I have it in my ancients set.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Leman on 03 May 2015, 07:54:46 AM
As I mentioned previously Impetus allows for maniple replacement under the pilum rule. Going further back in wargames time Ancient Empires had specific rules for maniples, but the set as a whole was very, very complex - phd required to play. Back in the 80s Donnington Fast Play Ancient rules had a very good and effective system for Roman maniples. The only reason I stopped playing them was the single figure removal system, but at the time they knocked WRG into a cocked hat.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Fenton on 03 May 2015, 08:11:46 AM
Armati kind of did it as well using the fatigue recovery rules
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: JimLeCat on 05 May 2015, 10:30:50 PM
Seems to me you, if you assume that the units are cohorts or bigger, that you could just give them regenerate and say it is their ability to rotate troops. No need to worry about exactly how it was accomplished...
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Luddite on 06 May 2015, 01:41:45 PM
Good thinking Jim, although regenerate doesn't work close up to the enemy.

I guess an understand what 'Maniple' actually did in battle will help.   :-\
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: JimLeCat on 06 May 2015, 06:54:25 PM
Ummm... That's not what the rules say? The only restrictions on Regenerate are not routing and no morale loss in the current turn.

Now, I agree that these are conditions that tend to be broken near enemy units, so there is a correlation with it not working near the enemy, but correlation is not causation...  ;)
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Luddite on 07 May 2015, 08:14:53 AM
Quote from: JimLeCat on 06 May 2015, 06:54:25 PM
Ummm... That's not what the rules say? The only restrictions on Regenerate are not routing and no morale loss in the current turn.

Now, I agree that these are conditions that tend to be broken near enemy units, so there is a correlation with it not working near the enemy, but correlation is not causation...  ;)

Ah yes of course.  I was thinking about CP expenditure.   Doh!
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: AndyT on 11 September 2015, 07:46:30 PM
Just reviving this topic. Has anyone seen Luddite's Warband Historical battle report?

http://luddite1811.blogspot.co.uk/2015/09/warband-historical-playtest-game-late.html (http://luddite1811.blogspot.co.uk/2015/09/warband-historical-playtest-game-late.html)

I'm really looking forward to an historical version.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bodvoc on 11 September 2015, 08:31:39 PM
Certainly looks good.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bloodaxe on 11 September 2015, 09:22:36 PM
Quote from: AndyT on 11 September 2015, 07:46:30 PM
Just reviving this topic. Has anyone seen Luddite's Warband Historical battle report?

http://luddite1811.blogspot.co.uk/2015/09/warband-historical-playtest-game-late.html (http://luddite1811.blogspot.co.uk/2015/09/warband-historical-playtest-game-late.html)

I'm really looking forward to an historical version.

Thanks! I missed this.
Great stuff.  I'd love to see a Historic Warband. It would be even better if fantasy armies could fight historical armies.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Kiwidave on 12 September 2015, 06:33:16 AM
A friend and I have had a go using Warband for Dark Ages - Rus (Dragon Men with magic) v Vikings (or Saxons - I can't remember as it was a while ago). It worked OK - the lists I came up with need a tweak or two, and I had to guess the points value of a few units. It has promise :)

If any is interested in what I came up with let me know and I'll send the lists (Viking, Anglo-Saxon, Anglo-Dane)
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bodvoc on 12 September 2015, 12:25:56 PM
I would like to see your lists please, if you could PM me with them?
Thanks
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bloodaxe on 12 September 2015, 08:42:14 PM
By all the Dice Gods, please let the army lists work with the current Pendraken miniatures range.
I hate when there are lists/rules for a unit and no miniature available.

This would be awesome if it could work with fantasy. Romans fight Orcs.  Carthage vs. the Undead.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: AndyT on 13 September 2015, 06:21:47 AM
I guess thats one reason why publication of Warband Historical is quite some time away. The Pendraken ancient figure range will need to expand and fill some gaps in order to match whatever armies are in the army lists.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Leon on 13 September 2015, 02:55:53 PM
Yep, we'll need to replace and expand a lot of the ancient ranges before we look at publishing these, which is something we're hoping to do once Phil's finished the Warband sculpting.  We want to completely revamp the Greeks/Persians, replace the Dacians and Sassanids, and add some new ranges as well.  With those done we'll probably look at revamping the Dark Age stuff as well, as those should be reasonably quick jobs.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bodvoc on 13 September 2015, 02:57:32 PM
Well KiwiDave kindly sent me his Dark Age lists which are very good. I have tentatively started work on a Norman List to complete those he has done. As for publishing a Warband Historical, Pendraken already do quite a range of Ancients, Dark Ages and Medieval armies. My suggestion would be to put the (12?) most popular armylists (in matched eras?) in the book and then add variety with free to download extra armylists on the website? Players could even share their own lists on this forum thus providing whatever period fix we all need. Otherwise it would be a very thick set of rules. However if Pendraken felt they needed to expand their ancients ranges I would not complain even though it would cost me a lot of money! :)
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bloodaxe on 13 September 2015, 04:57:58 PM
Great ideas.  Some play test rules & lists that could be put on the forum and tried by the forum members.
12 lists in the main book. Maybe an Army book with the other historical lists.
Something that would help new players that aren't history buffs, and may also help Pendraken miniatures sales- pendraken figure codes with army lists.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bloodaxe on 13 September 2015, 07:30:41 PM
I have a Norse/Vikings list somewhere. I'm not sure if I ever got around to posting it here. I have to find it, or recreate it.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Tawa on 14 September 2015, 10:17:27 AM
Quote from: Luddite on 24 March 2015, 03:26:31 PM
What I would say is...they certainly do.

A historical version may be under development at the moment.   :-/




Well, then. This sounds interesting :)
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: makebelievebkk on 17 September 2015, 07:31:34 AM
IMO historical has been done and done again, and again, and again... and as much as I love it, i dont see a need for another rule set :p

Now, I would love to see more range of Warband armies and in particular a bridge between historical and fantasy. Historical armies with their mythical additions e.g. Greeks with cyclops, hydras etc. Vikings with wolves and frost giants - even gods and demi gods. I know there are some skirmish rules out there that cover this but not on the battle scale of Warband.

Also, more fantasy lists in general :)

Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bodvoc on 17 September 2015, 09:26:05 AM
 Armies of Myth and Legend, sounds like a Warband supplement to me!
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Matt J on 17 September 2015, 09:28:09 AM
I like this idea I have a hankering to do ancient Greeks hoplites V's Undead ala Jason and the Argonauts but on a big scale.
Also Vikings with ulfenwerner Vs Zombie hordes would be fun
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Luddite on 17 September 2015, 09:48:30 AM
Quote from: Bodvoc on 17 September 2015, 09:26:05 AM
Armies of Myth and Legend, sounds like a Warband supplement to me!

Interesting idea.

Would a supplement with additional fantasy armies in be welcome?
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: AndyT on 17 September 2015, 04:51:10 PM
Quote from: makebelievebkk on 17 September 2015, 07:31:34 AM
IMO historical has been done and done again, and again, and again... and as much as I love it, i dont see a need for another rule set :p


For me 10mm scale is ideal in terms of space and storage requirements but Warmaster Ancients never quite felt right, especially where heavy cavalry seemed to dominate (just my humble opinion) so an Ancients version of Warband would be very welcome in my eyes, but I appreciate that it is a long way off.


Quote from: Luddite on 17 September 2015, 09:48:30 AM

Would a supplement with additional fantasy armies in be welcome?


Yes please. I never tire of writing army lists, or buying new figures for that matter :)

Cheers, Andy
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Bloodaxe on 17 September 2015, 06:22:29 PM
Quote from: AndyT on 17 September 2015, 04:51:10 PM
For me 10mm scale is ideal in terms of space and storage requirements but Warmaster Ancients never quite felt right, especially where heavy cavalry seemed to dominate (just my humble opinion) so an Ancients version of Warband would be very welcome in my eyes, but I appreciate that it is a long way off.


Yes please. I never tire of writing army lists, or buying new figures for that matter :)

Cheers, Andy


If there are complete miniature ranges to go with army lists, Id want it.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: owaincaesarius on 17 September 2015, 06:36:47 PM
Well as I have not yet played Warband maybe I am not the person to comment but I am all for a historical version. Reading through the command/control section and the rather neat movement and match up rules I straight away thought that here was a set that could work well for historical battles. Bring it on!
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Leon026 on 21 October 2015, 03:29:41 PM
What about imagi-nations?

I'm tempted to throw myself into the foray of 10mm medieval (12th-15th century), but I don't have a particular affinity with a specific period, unlike napoleonics. I'm also unsure with which ruleset to go for, Hail Caesar or Warband, but I really did enjoy Warmaster. But wouldn't imagi-nations get the best of both? Creating a fantasy Grand Principality of Leondo to play against warband necromantic barbarians with their undead friends that ravage the countryside could be really interesting in of itself, and I for one would certainly be tempted.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Leman on 21 October 2015, 07:29:23 PM
Has anyone else seen the historical mythical lists for Hordes of the Things, e.g.. Greek myth, Japanese myth, Arthurian, Faerie Queene, Conquistador, Napoleonic (Mr. Norrel?), Victorian Science Fiction etc., etc. I wouldn't think it wouldn"t take too much effort to convert these to Warband if that's your thing. My own preference is for Da Vinci Italian, but I'm messing about with Maximilian for that, with 10mm figures on the 28mm size bases.
Title: Re: Warband historical
Post by: Nosher on 21 October 2015, 11:01:00 PM
Quote from: Luddite on 17 September 2015, 09:48:30 AM
Interesting idea.

Would a supplement with additional fantasy armies in be welcome?


Definstely. If the ranges are there to support it