During a mahoosive Warmaster game last week the dice, as they usually do, averaged out eventually.
When the dust had settled and I was packing away I took stock of command decisions, troop performance and final positions. It occurred to me that, yet again, my flagellants (think psychotic religious nutters) didn't do anything at all; they never do but I love the unit.
My halberdiers however (cheap as chips infantry dross) had excelled as usual.
So, which are your perennially over / under performing units?
I get the feeling my Janissaries don't usually give value for money.
Quote from: FierceKitty on 01 March 2015, 10:24:28 AM
I get the feeling my Janissaries don't usually give value for money.
And your best unit?
Hmmmm....Red Devil Ii Samurai, perhaps? Royal troop of Polish Hussars? The Maria Theresa cuirassier regiment? I haven't kept exact records.
Most recently the Austrian grenadiers in my two games of Blucher. Supposedly my best troops, they both disappeared very rapidly after rolling lots of 1-3s.
Quote from: Leman on 01 March 2015, 10:56:18 AM
Most recently the Austrian grenadiers in my two games of Blucher. Supposedly my best troops, they both disappeared very rapidly after rolling lots of 1-3s.
Yep, I'm good at that :-\
Quote from: FierceKitty on 01 March 2015, 10:31:32 AM
Hmmmm....Red Devil Ii Samurai, perhaps? Royal troop of Polish Hussars? The Maria Theresa cuirassier regiment? I haven't kept exact records.
Don't worry, you won't be audited ;)
French AT guns in Command Decision one dug in hidden company of them took out a combined Pz3 and 4 battalion for no loses
The German spoilsports then hit them with several Stukas
Everything else I have ever used in the last 35 years has been useless. I am beginning to think it might be me that's the problem
In the last 3 Sudan games an early Egyptian unit held of Hadendowah attacks. In the same games the highlanders and naval brigade were pushed back/ square destroyed.
My halberdiers ( volkssturm) bounced a unit of Dragon Ogres (Tiger tanks) which had charged them!
One of those where you're actually a bit embarrassed about the excellence of your own dice rolls. :-[
Definately my churchill avre, for both best and worse.
He usually gets to do nothing as he gets destroyed, BUT there is so much fire pumped into him because his stats are scary and they don't want him close to their line, that the rest gets ignored untill the avre burning. That can win you a game.
(http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff441/petercooman123/DSC02527_zps1190fb17.jpg) (http://s1236.photobucket.com/user/petercooman123/media/DSC02527_zps1190fb17.jpg.html)
Is that a flame unit Peter; I'm new to all this WW2 stuff :)
Worst
I used to play masses of DBM (unfortunately my opponents switched to the lamentable FoG :( ), but my DBM Mongols almost always included the 'slave troops' (Irregular Hordes, Inferior).
These speed bumps almost always performed well above their seeming potential
Best
At the moment, in Dystopian Wars, its got to be my Japanese Uwatsu frigates. Super little ships that always perform well.
I love "speed bump" troops, they always bring unmitigated trouble to the enemy.
Quote from: petercooman on 01 March 2015, 11:36:48 AM
Definately my churchill avre, for both best and worse.
He usually gets to do nothing as he gets destroyed, BUT there is so much fire pumped into him because his stats are scary and they don't want him close to their line, that the rest gets ignored untill the avre burning. That can win you a game.
When I played Warhammer fantasy I had a unit of Night Goblins 40+ strong. Everyone was terrified of it and hit it with everything they had. Ignoring 2x 16 strong goblin wolf riders and 2x 12 strong orc boar boys....on the downside sometimes they did fall out which is why the black orcs followed them in ant the rest of the orcs made their way across the table.
Quote from: getagrip on 01 March 2015, 11:43:35 AM
Is that a flame unit Peter; I'm new to all this WW2 stuff :)
No the churchill avre was armed with a petard spigot mortar (290mm !). In BKCII it has the following profile:
move 15, AT 12/10, AP 12/10, CA 4, HITS 6, ARMOUR 4 THOUGH. flank hits do not reduce armour save.
So you can see, you don't want it close to your bunker or trenchline ;D ;D ;D
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/19/290mm_Petard_with_ammunition.jpg/640px-290mm_Petard_with_ammunition.jpg)
Quote from: Maenoferren on 01 March 2015, 12:21:26 PM
When I played Warhammer fantasy I had a unit of Night Goblins 40+ strong. Everyone was terrified of it and hit it with everything they had. Ignoring 2x 16 strong goblin wolf riders and 2x 12 strong orc boar boys....on the downside sometimes they did fall out which is why the black orcs followed them in ant the rest of the orcs made their way across the table.
AH yes i know that tactic ;)
HEre are mine, but i use 50 gobbos :
(http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff441/petercooman123/dwarfs/DSC02156.jpg) (http://s1236.photobucket.com/user/petercooman123/media/dwarfs/DSC02156.jpg.html)
(http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff441/petercooman123/dwarfs/DSC02159.jpg) (http://s1236.photobucket.com/user/petercooman123/media/dwarfs/DSC02159.jpg.html)
Quote from: Luddite on 01 March 2015, 12:08:59 PM
Worst
I used to play masses of DBM (unfortunately my opponents switched to the lamentable FoG :( ), but my DBM Mongols almost always included the 'slave troops' (Irregular Hordes, Inferior).
These speed bumps almost always performed well above their seeming potential
I must have led a really sheltered wargaming life as that is another phrase I haven't come across before. Normally very apt though.
Worst unit that I can think of was my 5mm Napoleonic Saxon Tirailleurs d'Egidi that got shot apart every game I used them.
Got a worst army which I can remember very vividly.
Going waaayyy back I used Prince August goblin moulds to make myself an army as everyone was doing Warhammer at the time. All nicely painted and individually based (nightmare to move) so I was quite chuffed with them. Some bright spark suggested a internal Warhammer league so we all agreed. My first game was against the recently invented Easterlings (or some such, my mate used Samurai which is roughly what they were like anyway). So I lines up me chaps and off I go...straight into a feckin wall of arrows. At that time these Easterlings had longbows (48" range) and could also use the 4" forward out of cover, fire and 4" back into cover. My army had shortbows (24" range) and by the time I got within range I had lost half my army. Sold the bl**dy lot at the next B&B!
Never played the same army for long enough for a best unit.
My 15mm winged hussars, my pride and joy, get regularly hammered.
Quote from: petercooman on 01 March 2015, 12:24:36 PM
No the churchill avre was armed with a petard spigot mortar (290mm !). In BKCII it has the following profile:
move 15, AT 12/10, AP 12/10, CA 4, HITS 6, ARMOUR 4 THOUGH. flank hits do not reduce armour save.
So you can see, you don't want it close to your bunker or trenchline ;D ;D ;D
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/19/290mm_Petard_with_ammunition.jpg/640px-290mm_Petard_with_ammunition.jpg)
Man alive; those stats!
Quote from: getagrip on 01 March 2015, 02:27:01 PM
Man alive; those stats!
On the subject of night goblins; everyone was terrified of them because of the possibility of fanatics lurking inside the unit >:(
Yep ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Quote from: Maenoferren on 01 March 2015, 03:22:20 PM
Yep ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
:P
You then do the double bluff, don't put any fanatics in, march toward the opposition uber unit which promptly runs away from about 60 point of trash :D
Quote from: getagrip on 01 March 2015, 03:26:33 PM
:P
You then do the double bluff, don't put any fanatics in, march toward the opposition uber unit which promptly runs away from about 60 point of trash :D
Have I played against you....you know how I think
Undoubtedly my best performing unit were the Byzantine peasants I took as part of my warband for Retinue (http://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/24824/retinue-medieval-skirmish-rules). Their volleys of stones took out vastly more than their points value over the course of our many games!
Worst performing has to be my Warmaster Dragon Rider who lost a combat against a unit of Empire Halberdiers despite charging them in the flank and being supported by a hero on a dragon!!! The nadir of a dismal career :)
Quote from: Maenoferren on 01 March 2015, 03:28:38 PM
Have I played against you....you know how I think
;D ;D ;D
Dirty gobbo tactics >:( :P
Best: my 2nd Infantry platoon of my 15mm german infantry. Assault monsters and won me so many different games in so many different rules systems!
Worst: whichever elite unit I have just painted and put on the table for the first time! "Gone!"
Quote from: mad lemmey on 01 March 2015, 04:19:53 PM
Worst: whichever elite unit I have just painted and put on the table for the first time! "Gone!"
Not just me then :'(
The worst thing is the pride with which you place them on the table only to have to remove them! >:(
It doesn't help that they might as well have a big pink neon sign saying "Fire magnet!"
Doomed as soon as they get on table!
Quote from: mad lemmey on 01 March 2015, 04:27:49 PM
It doesn't help that they might as well have a big pink neon sign saying "Fire magnet!"
Doomed as soon as they get on table!
Yeah, no matter where you put 'em they either get pummelled or charged!
My ECW royalist cavalry are my best troops.
My Polish Winged Hussars are pretty but thats about it....
I know Barry Hilton in his League of Augsburg website (there is a blog and forum too) kept unit battle histories for his 9YW units but i could never be bothered with that kind of thing. Anyhoo. When we paint new units, are we sitting there going, "whoah, whoah, whoa, whoah, whoah. :d :d :d wait 'til these boys hit the table!" thinking because they look the biz, they'll do the biz? There appears to be a pattern. Newly painted units are p*** (poor - that's the word I was looking for). Is it a myth? Or do we expect them to do daft things, perform impossible heroics or what? Strangely, I don't have a best / worst unit with the heroes in the last game tending to be the villains in the next. Personally, I suspect I subconsciously say to myself, "these guys were brilliant in the last game" and so I expect them to be wonderful in the next game. And usually they ain't.
The best performing unit / figure at the Tring Club was "Small bow with stick". He was supposed to be a shepherd or something, but basically in skirmish games counted as having an improvised weapon.
Virtually every game he took on mail clad waroiors mounted or dismounted and often killed several of them before either running away or eventually being killed.
This all sound relatively imposible until you start reading about the effectiveness of a Quarterstaff.
Quote from: Just a few Orcs on 02 March 2015, 12:05:48 PM
The best performing unit / figure at the Tring Club was "Small bow with stick". He was supposed to be a shepherd or something, but basically in skirmish games counted as having an improvised weapon.
Virtually every game he took on mail clad waroiors mounted or dismounted and often killed several of them before either running away or eventually being killed.
This all sound relatively imposible until you start reading about the effectiveness of a Quarterstaff.
Quick, he's coming....
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_4mjKOmLYFfQ/TCRHLUhLB8I/AAAAAAAAAGo/umQRdKy-y7k/s1600/Bow+and+Arrow+6.jpg)
Best: my PanzerIVF2's. Beats up on allied tankers all the time! ;)
Lately is has been my TYW Catholic cavalry. Keeps just messing up the Protestants! Dice just go cold on the other guy... :o
Worst: TIE fighters from that crazy (and now Disney) game. Can't seem to keep them in the 'air'. Of course I stink at any kind of dogfighting game. :-[
(Can anyone tell: I end up playing the 'bad' guys a lot.)
Quote from: gregernest on 02 March 2015, 08:06:44 PM
Worst: TIE fighters from that crazy (and now Disney) game. Can't seem to keep them in the 'air'. Of course I stink at any kind of dogfighting game. :-[
Tried the interceptors? They are super to do your dogfighthing. If i am low on points i sometimes take tie bombers, equally good at dogfighting but double the survivability!
Sure have. It's the player in this case. :( :o :(
Tie defenders are a bit good too! ;)
Another unit of mine that always gets hammered are chariots; I never get their movement right and they get charged. ~X(
Quote from: getagrip on 02 March 2015, 09:18:58 PM
Another unit of mine that always gets hammered are chariots; I never get their movement right and they get charged. ~X(
How much?
Quote from: Just a few Orcs on 02 March 2015, 12:05:48 PM
The best performing unit / figure at the Tring Club was "Small bow with stick". He was supposed to be a shepherd or something, but basically in skirmish games counted as having an improvised weapon.
Virtually every game he took on mail clad waroiors mounted or dismounted and often killed several of them before either running away or eventually being killed.
This all sound relatively imposible until you start reading about the effectiveness of a Quarterstaff.
That should have said "SMALL BOY WITH STICK" :-[
Quote from: Just a few Orcs on 03 March 2015, 11:15:40 AM
That should have said "SMALL BOY WITH STICK" :-[
En Garde
(http://blog.kidstravel2.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/stick_sword_front.jpg)
I have a small boy, add a stick he is bloody lethal! (mostly to any expensive brittle inanimate object around the house)
Quote from: mad lemmey on 02 March 2015, 09:10:15 PM
Tie defenders are a bit good too! ;)
Can't say, i only buy ships seen in the original trilogy . I decided this because otherwise i would keep throwing money at x-wing forever.I enjoy the game very much, but a normal 100 point squad wil usually have between 3 and 8 fighters, so i have enough (i have 25) to keep me amused for a long time anyway!
Quote from: petercooman on 03 March 2015, 07:56:41 PM
Can't say, i only buy ships seen in the original trilogy . I decided this because otherwise i would keep throwing money at x-wing forever.I enjoy the game very much, but a normal 100 point squad wil usually have between 3 and 8 fighters, so i have enough (i have 25) to keep me amused for a long time anyway!
Never played but the minis are soooooooo cool!
Especially for someone who grew up in the 70's :)
I have a box full of the old Micro-Machines Star Wars stuff. Not sure I want to shell out for X-Wing, given the prices of the models, when I have equivalents already.
Quote from: Matt of Munslow on 03 March 2015, 11:46:41 AM
I have a small boy, add a stick he is bloody lethal! (mostly to any expensive brittle inanimate object around the house)
Yep I know that feeling well....
Quote from: Ithoriel on 03 March 2015, 08:32:52 PM
I have a box full of the old Micro-Machines Star Wars stuff. Not sure I want to shell out for X-Wing, given the prices of the models, when I have equivalents already.
come on, you know you want to!
In defence of x wing, i find the price to be fair.You get a nice looking, painted modeland every expansion adds something new,be it different upgrades or skills for your pilot, wich can be mixed and matched among other ships/factions, and in case of the larger ships, new scenarios.
Of course if you rather use your stuff, how would you think about using them? any rulesets you use/have in mind?
Quote from: petercooman on 03 March 2015, 09:34:05 PM
come on, you know you want to!
In defence of x wing, i find the price to be fair.You get a nice looking, painted modeland every expansion adds something new,be it different upgrades or skills for your pilot, wich can be mixed and matched among other ships/factions, and in case of the larger ships, new scenarios.
Of course if you rather use your stuff, how would you think about using them? any rulesets you use/have in mind?
They were bought in the first place to use with the local club WW1 dogfight rules - worked remarkably well, considering.
Well x wing has a bit of wings of glory in it so not that odd a thought :)
Quote from: petercooman on 03 March 2015, 11:57:30 PM
Well x wing has a bit of wings of glory in it so not that odd a thought :)
The craft in Starwars seem to fly like aircraft rather than spacecraft so no surprises there ;)
Apparently the space battles were originally mocked up using WW2 dogfights - hence the idea of using the club dogfight rules. Multi-player, one ship each, pre-planned moves, lots of fun!
Quote from: Ithoriel on 04 March 2015, 10:32:29 AM
lots of fun!
And that's what really counts, doesn't it? m/ m/ m/
Quote from: petercooman on 04 March 2015, 11:06:54 AM
And that's what really counts, doesn't it? m/ m/ m/
They're the first, second and third most important things about our hobby; can't help but feel some people occasionally forget that :)
I love X-Wing, got into when it was released due to the fact I am a big fan, something to do with seeing the original back in 1977 and being totally blown away with the whole idea and that is uses a very similar mechanic to Wings of War got me well and truely hooked.
All I can say about the other comments is FUN is the main reason I enjoy gaming as it allows us to escape to reality for a few hours :-bd :-bd :-bd
That is so true.
Reality phah!
Quote from: mad lemmey on 04 March 2015, 12:17:05 PM
That is so true.
Reality phah!
;)
Want your gaming "real?"
Here's a bag of marbles; there's the M1: enjoy your game!
Quote from: Ithoriel on 04 March 2015, 10:32:29 AM
Apparently the space battles were originally mocked up using WW2 dogfights - hence the idea of using the club dogfight rules. Multi-player, one ship each, pre-planned moves, lots of fun!
Watch the end of the original Star Wars: New Hope in conjunction with the Dambusters and you'll see a fair amount of almost frame by frame similarity!
Xwing? Pah, gimme a Lancaster any day :D
Quote from: toxicpixie on 04 March 2015, 03:18:11 PM
Watch the end of the original Star Wars: New Hope in conjunction with the Dambusters and you'll see a fair amount of almost frame by frame similarity!
You make a good point ;)
Anyone can fly a snub fighter down a trench, a real pilot can do it in a four engine heavy bomber with props ;)
Quote from: toxicpixie on 04 March 2015, 03:56:33 PM
Anyone can fly a snub fighter down a trench, a real pilot can do it in a four engine heavy bomber with props ;)
Don't you need air for the engines? Just sayin'... :o
Quote from: toxicpixie on 04 March 2015, 03:56:33 PM
Anyone can fly a snub fighter down a trench, a real pilot can do it in a four engine heavy bomber with props ;)
Easy, I used to bulls-eye womprats in my T16 back home. ;)
Nah, if space fighters fly like aeroplanes, then I'm sure aeroplanes fly like space fighters!
Quote from: toxicpixie on 04 March 2015, 03:56:33 PM
Anyone can fly a snub fighter down a trench, a real pilot can do it in a four engine heavy bomber with props ;)
Something that really put this in context for me was they had to bomb from 60' over water at night :o
The wing span of a Lancaster is
102' :o :o :o :o :o :o
Vulcan pilots flew under each other at 60'.
A Vulcans tail plane is...
Never mind the Kessel Run, that's some serious flying!
Now if Phil Taylor had been flying the F-104 Starfighter he would have hit the target every time. They fell out of the sky so often they were nicknamed 'lawn darts'.
Flying a Lancaster down that trench and hitting a 2m square
target with a bouncing bomb would be impressive :o
I saw a documentary on the F-104 in West German service. It was apparently an astonishingly tricky aircraft to fly an maintain. I gather no one ever felt very comfortable in one...
Pierre - that's pretty much easier than the original dambusters mission!
Quote from: toxicpixie link=topic=11580.msg1534 :-\03#msg153403 date=1425516989
I saw a documentary on the F-104 in West German service. It was apparently an astonishingly tricky aircraft to fly an maintain. I gather no one ever felt very comfortable in one...
Pierre - that's pretty much easier than the original dambusters mission!
Yes guess it would be ~ "the force" would be with them...they. are the royal air force
after all :)
Sorry that's a bad pun ;)
Quote from: pierre the shy on 05 March 2015, 02:13:01 AM
Sorry that's a bad pun ;)
Oh, don't let that stop you ;)
It's practically an entrance fee around here :D
Quote from: toxicpixie on 05 March 2015, 12:56:29 AM
I saw a documentary on the F-104 in West German service. It was apparently an astonishingly tricky aircraft to fly an maintain. I gather no one ever felt very comfortable in one...
It wasn't nicknamed "the widow-maker" for nothing. Mind you, the Germans did insist on hanging munitions on something that was designed as an interceptor.
Yeah, the program did mention that :( 110 dead pilots from the West Germans alone.
According to Wiki they lost a third of their aircraft to accidents, the Canadians nearly half.