Pendraken Miniatures Forum

Wider Wargaming => Genre/Period Discussion => Ancients to Renaissance (3000BC - 1680) => Topic started by: DanJ on 19 October 2014, 05:43:59 PM

Title: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: DanJ on 19 October 2014, 05:43:59 PM
Went to NW Scotland in early September and came back via Berwick upon Tweed and the Northumberland Coast

Berwick was on the Anglo-Scottish Border for hundreds of years and its defences were fully modernised by Elizabeth the first then almost immediately were rendered unnecessary by the Union of the Crowns under James 1.  Fortunately almost the entire Elizabethan circumference can still be seen and walked around, both from below and from above.

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa242/danandsan/IMG_9916.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/danandsan/media/IMG_9916.jpg.html)

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa242/danandsan/IMG_9939.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/danandsan/media/IMG_9939.jpg.html)

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa242/danandsan/IMG_9947.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/danandsan/media/IMG_9947.jpg.html)

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa242/danandsan/IMG_9960.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/danandsan/media/IMG_9960.jpg.html)

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa242/danandsan/IMG_9970a.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/danandsan/media/IMG_9970a.jpg.html)

Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Duke Speedy of Leighton on 19 October 2014, 05:57:59 PM
Wow, cool! :)
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Techno on 19 October 2014, 07:10:38 PM
Nice pics, that man !
Cheers - Phil
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: howayman on 19 October 2014, 07:25:52 PM
It was also at war with Russia until quite recently.
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Maenoferren on 19 October 2014, 08:18:22 PM
I thought it still was at war with Russia...
who Surrendered??? :o
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Ithoriel on 19 October 2014, 09:32:37 PM
Quote from: Maenoferren on 19 October 2014, 08:18:22 PM
I thought it still was at war with Russia...
who Surrendered??? :o

A treaty was signed in 1966 iirc.

Pretty sure that Berwick was not technically or actually at war with Russia but still a nice PR stunt.
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: FierceKitty on 20 October 2014, 12:47:23 AM
Wot, no safety rails?
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: FierceKitty on 20 October 2014, 12:49:57 AM
http://northeasthistorytour.blogspot.com/2010/06/berwick-v-russia-and-other-unfinished.html  for the peace treaty.

By the way, for overlong wars, how about the third Punic war? Ended 1985 A. D. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_extended_by_diplomatic_irregularity

Berwick looks stunning. Who'd have thought it of dull little Britain?
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Duke Speedy of Leighton on 20 October 2014, 06:10:37 AM
Thank you FK, I now have a new war to add to my 'conflicts that never happened'
Huéscar vs Danmark sounds fun!
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: nikharwood on 20 October 2014, 01:09:08 PM
Nice pics, Dan - thanks for posting  8)
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Poggle on 20 October 2014, 03:41:03 PM
Great photos, thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: DanJ on 20 October 2014, 03:58:24 PM
Northumberland has much to offer the military enthusiast, apart from Berwick, its got the best bits of Hadrian's Wall, reputedly more castles, towers and fortified houses per square mile than any other county in England, the whole border reiver thing and Flodden Field is just over the border.

Its also got a fantastic coast and great food and drink.
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Subedai on 20 October 2014, 05:00:16 PM
Quote from: DanJ on 20 October 2014, 03:58:24 PM
Northumberland has much to offer the military enthusiast, apart from Berwick, its got the best bits of Hadrian's Wall, reputedly more castles, towers and fortified houses per square mile than any other county in England, the whole border reiver thing and Flodden Field is just over the border.

Its also got a fantastic coast and great food and drink.

Do you by any chance work for the Northumberland Tourist Board?  ;)
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Maenoferren on 20 October 2014, 06:10:32 PM
Quote from: DanJ on 20 October 2014, 03:58:24 PM
Northumberland has much to offer the military enthusiast, apart from Berwick, its got the best bits of Hadrian's Wall, reputedly more castles, towers and fortified houses per square mile than any other county in England, the whole border reiver thing and Flodden Field is just over the border.

Its also got a fantastic coast and great food and drink.
I lived in one of, if not the most fortified towns in Britain. Every other house was a Bastle or similar. Those Reivers made Haltwhistle a safer place.
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: fred. on 20 October 2014, 08:21:09 PM
Berwick's walls are very cool. We were there last year, and there are no fences around the walls, just the odd sign warning of big drops!

Most of the photos show the casemates built behind the ravelins (?) that were there to provide fire along the walls - presumably to shoot away any attackers who made it close to the walls - not sure if the matching casemate at the opposite end would have been vulnerable to this fire?

Is the second from last picture from the other side of the river? I don't recognise the walls into the water?
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Matt J on 21 October 2014, 10:44:42 AM
Quotenot sure if the matching casemate at the opposite end would have been vulnerable to this fire?

probably meant for firing grape shot
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Leman on 23 October 2014, 02:50:45 PM
The tide's in in the penultimate shot. I believe Berwick is still on the Anglo-Scottish border.
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: DanJ on 23 October 2014, 03:03:08 PM
As DP said the tide was in, the shot is looking along the wall as it runs parallel with the river, towards the sea.

Berwick itself is a couple of miles inside England although its football team plays in a Scottish league.
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Lord Kermit of Birkenhead on 24 October 2014, 07:32:23 AM
The reason that Berwick declared war on Russia, it could never tell which side of the border it's on - unfortunate or English  :d.

IanS
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Pijlie on 03 December 2014, 04:17:54 PM
Quote from: Subedai on 20 October 2014, 05:00:16 PM
Do you by any chance work for the Northumberland Tourist Board?  ;)

I can wholeheartedly and from first hand experience confirm DanJ's statements  :)
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: DanJ on 04 December 2014, 09:31:47 AM

QuoteDo you by any chance work for the Northumberland Tourist Board?

No, but all my family come from there unfortunately by a cruel twist of fate I was born in Northumberland but in Watford  >:(

Here's a shot of Dunstanborough Castle.

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa242/danandsan/9-3.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/danandsan/media/9-3.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: jchaos79 on 04 December 2014, 10:33:29 AM
wow such a beauty!
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Leman on 04 December 2014, 12:55:16 PM
Dunstanburgh also makes for a great walk.
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: DanJ on 04 December 2014, 01:45:46 PM
QuoteDunstanburgh also makes for a great walk

It certainly does, Craster up to Seahouses or Bamborough (or the other way round) is one of my favourite walks.  Here's Dunstanburgh from the Crater side.

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa242/danandsan/IMG_4052.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/danandsan/media/IMG_4052.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Techno on 04 December 2014, 02:26:52 PM
I see some really weird 'shapes' in the silhouette shot ! ;D ;D ;D
There's a dobey dog, with a really long neck....Sam, the eagle....And 3 kings with crowns having a chin-wag.

(I need some of Nobby's pills !)

Cheers - Mr C Ingthings.
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Hertsblue on 04 December 2014, 03:10:33 PM
If you want a truly spectacular fortress try Ehrenbreitstein, just across the Rhine from Coblenz. It only has fortifications on one side - the other is a sheer drop of a hundred feet or so.

(http://www.travel1000places.com/ResV/destination_img/de/Koblenz/Koblenz-Fortress-Ehrenbreitstein_500x375.jpg)
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: paulr on 04 December 2014, 07:15:03 PM
Quote from: Techno on 04 December 2014, 02:26:52 PM
I see some really weird 'shapes' in the silhouette shot ! ;D ;D ;D
There's a dobey dog, with a really long neck....Sam, the eagle....And 3 kings with crowns having a chin-wag.

(I need some of Nobby's pills !)

Cheers - Mr C Ingthings.

Arrrrrrrgh...........  I see them now  8-} 8-} 8-}
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Techno on 04 December 2014, 07:22:41 PM
Good !  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
(Don't take any notice of me.....My eyes go a bit weird looking at wee figures all day.)
Cheers - Phil
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Lord Kermit of Birkenhead on 05 December 2014, 08:00:16 AM
Calm Down, Calm Down......

IanS
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: DanJ on 05 December 2014, 09:32:37 AM
So I go to interesting, out of the way places, photograph them as well as I'm able, open a photobucket account, upload the photos, start a new thread, link the pictures to the Pendraken Forum hoping to provide some measure of interest and the response is....

QuoteThere's a dobey dog, with a really long neck....Sam, the eagle....And 3 kings with crowns having a chin-wag

~X(

;)
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Lord Kermit of Birkenhead on 05 December 2014, 11:56:49 AM
You expected sanity - HERE....

IanS
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Ithoriel on 05 December 2014, 02:04:21 PM
Quote from: ianrs54 on 05 December 2014, 11:56:49 AM
You expected sanity - HERE....

IanS

But .... but .... at this time of year .... what about the sanity clause?
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: DanJ on 05 December 2014, 03:42:22 PM
I think the "mental 'Elf" of this forum just dropped another notch
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Leman on 05 December 2014, 03:43:03 PM
Someone sack him!
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Lord Kermit of Birkenhead on 05 December 2014, 03:50:44 PM
Phil - get their COATS NOW....

IanS
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Duke Speedy of Leighton on 05 December 2014, 05:19:39 PM
Stop it, you're sleighing me!
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Leman on 05 December 2014, 10:48:03 PM
Ho Ho Ho!
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: paulr on 05 December 2014, 11:14:56 PM
Quote from: DanJ on 04 December 2014, 09:31:47 AM
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa242/danandsan/9-3.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/danandsan/media/9-3.jpg.html)

Quote from: DanJ on 05 December 2014, 09:32:37 AM
So I go to interesting, out of the way places, photograph them as well as I'm able, open a photobucket account, upload the photos, start a new thread, link the pictures to the Pendraken Forum hoping to provide some measure of interest and the response is....

~X(

;)

It is a good photograph of the castle and the silhouette works well. The breaking wave provides good foreground interest and adds to the mood

I would probably crop tighter on the right so the viewers eye doesn't flow down hill and out of the image.

You could also consider cropping on the left to remove fence line on the ridge line, currently it is an intrusion and once seen can be distracting

Perhaps increasing the contrast would emphasise the silhouette

Is that more the response you were hoping for?

The earlier fortification photos were also interesting  :)
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Leman on 06 December 2014, 09:16:48 AM
However, cropping the fence line will lose some of the impressive wave action.
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Duke Speedy of Leighton on 06 December 2014, 09:50:37 AM
I think it works brilliantly just as it is.
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: jchaos79 on 06 December 2014, 02:01:44 PM
Looking the picture, is what should feel a Danese viking in his boat after being rading the castle all night in the first lights in the morning
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: DanJ on 08 December 2014, 09:29:45 AM
Quote
It is a good photograph of the castle and the silhouette works well. The breaking wave provides good foreground interest and adds to the mood

I would probably crop tighter on the right so the viewers eye doesn't flow down hill and out of the image.

You could also consider cropping on the left to remove fence line on the ridge line, currently it is an intrusion and once seen can be distracting

Perhaps increasing the contrast would emphasise the silhouette

At last, creative critisism.  ;)

I've already cropped quite a bit in from the right of the original picture but left it like this to ephasise the castle being on a hill.  The contrast has also been tweeked a bit but I found that much more than this and the spray was being lost, but that might be my hamfistedness with photoshop (and I don't have a full version).  On the day the wind was quite strong and blowing from the land so as the waves broke the wind was ripping the tops off them as spreay.
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: paulr on 08 December 2014, 11:31:04 PM
Glad to be of service
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Westmarcher on 10 December 2014, 06:54:29 PM
Personally, I would have kept the topless blonde sunbathing on the beach in the shot. But that's just me.

[btw, to clarify, Flodden Field is in Northumberland and the projections from the walls are bastions (ravelins are detached triangular fortifications or outworks located in front of the curtain walls and bastions of a fortress)]
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: DanJ on 11 December 2014, 10:41:55 PM
QuoteFlodden Field is in Northumberland

I stand corrected, I thought it was just over the border.

Here's a couple of other border strong holds

Smailholm Tower...

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa242/danandsan/DSC09190.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/danandsan/media/DSC09190.jpg.html)

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa242/danandsan/DSC09194.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/danandsan/media/DSC09194.jpg.html)

And Hemitage, both in the care of Historic Scotland so I guess they are over the border.

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa242/danandsan/DSC09197.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/danandsan/media/DSC09197.jpg.html)

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa242/danandsan/DSC09203.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/danandsan/media/DSC09203.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: fred. on 11 December 2014, 10:48:38 PM
They are some cool looking strongholds - the gateway on the second one is huge!

Are you interested in some photo feedback on these?
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Bodvoc on 12 December 2014, 08:06:03 AM
Hi Dan, could you let us know whereabouts these are as they look well worth a visit.
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Ithoriel on 12 December 2014, 08:09:34 AM
Couple more Scottish castles - Dirleton (top) is in East Lothian and Craigmillar (bottom) is in South East Edinburgh


(http://i1335.photobucket.com/albums/w669/ithoriel/Castles/DirletonCastle_zps67fdc044.jpg)


(http://i1335.photobucket.com/albums/w669/ithoriel/Castles/CraigmillarCastle_zps35720dee.jpg)
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: DanJ on 12 December 2014, 09:29:15 AM

QuoteHi Dan, could you let us know whereabouts these are as they look well worth a visit.

Hermitage is here and quite easy to find

Newcastleton, Roxburghshire, Scotland
GB grid reference NY495960

Smailholm is here:

Smailholm, about five miles (8 km) west of Kelso in the Scottish Borders grid reference NT637346

What looks like a huge gateway is, if memory servers, simply a big arch connecting the two corner towers, I'm pretty sure there's another one on the other side the actual door way is pretty small.  Hemitage was the seat of the Armstrongs in Liddesdale, a notorious reveiving family.  One of my favourite  (and probably apocryphal ) stories from the border has a stranger at a border gathering, possibly a pub, being so appalled at the behaviour that he asked "Are there no Christian Men here?" to which someone replied "No, there's only Armstrongs and Elliots"
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Westmarcher on 12 December 2014, 01:55:47 PM
Britain is full of gems like these. The reason most of them seem to survive is that many of them are away out in the sticks somewhere so a car is essential. I am a long standing member of Friends of Historic Scotland. It means I can flash my ... er ... card and walk into any of the 400+ Historic Scotland sites without having to pay any entry fee (including Edinburgh and Stirling castles). I get a quarterly magazine and there is also a 20% retail discount in all Historic Scotland shops incl. books (but not booze - boo hiss!  :( - I think its still 10% for booze).

What may be of interest to non-Scottish residents (and there are many non-Scottish resident members), are the reciprocal arrangements with the 500+ properties of English Heritage, Cadw (Welsh) and Manx National Heritage. In your first FoHS year of membership, entry in these properties is half price and free in your second and subsequent years. In my first few years, I can say I certainly got my money's worth to the extent one of my daughters once howled, "Oh no, not another castle!" - she eventually went on to study archaelogy at university (although nowadays I'm probably subsidising them). And it was great when we went on holiday in England and Wales. Tourists can also get a short term pass which may offer some decent savings. Looking for some fresh air and an excuse to go somewhere on holiday or on a weekend? In my view, well worth it!  :-bd

P.S. You probably think I am on some sort of retainer, here, for recommending these great organisations that look after our heritage. Alas, no. Here are some links below for more details (sorry if any link doesn't work - site addresses are valid however). 

www.historic-scotland.gov.uk/ (http://www.historic-scotland.gov.uk/)
www.english-heritage.org.uk (http://www.english-heritage.org.uk)
www.cadw.wales.gov.uk (http://www.cadw.wales.gov.uk)
www.gov.im/mnh (http://www.gov.im/mnh)
Title: Re: Berwick upon Tweed
Post by: Bodvoc on 12 December 2014, 02:24:41 PM
Thanks for the info Dan, my family and I are heading up to the borders at Easter for a week so we need a few places of interest to visit. These are now noted as some of the places I wish to visit.
Cheers!