Another one to boost replies for compulsive posters

[SV52]

Who cares, do what you like, it's only a game!

[Zippee]

Who cares, do what you like, it's only a game!

Absolutely not! It's my life, my religion, my soap box - it certainly is not 'just a game'

Football that's just a game and dull as dishwater. What I do is far, far more important, vital and interesting and well important than that tosh.

How dare you tell me not to care about my passion sirree - swords, dawn, your place! 

[skywalker]

I don't see what the problem is. I have been involved in demonstration games using the Arnhem scenario book for Rapid Fire rules and had great fun. On the other side of the coin we once did a Very German Civil War game loosely based on Operation Valkyre and yes I was Tom Cruise   
If we all liked exactly the same stuff life would be so BORING 

[Westmarcher]

A lot of the talk here is not about imagi-Nations but of alternative histories and other 'what if' scenarios involving real nations. As regards imagined Nations (i.e., nations that do not exist except in someone's mind), I think my favourite is probably Pottsdorf - a late 19th Century / early 20th Century game with the forces of Crown Prince Hapnick on the one hand against the rebels led by Baron Rolfe von Stuppe and General Kuhster might be quite fun!   

What's yours?

[Zippee]

Pretty sure Kriegsspiel was imagi-nations

if it was good enough for Reisswitz it should be good enough for us

But I agree imagi-nations is a specific thing in wargame circles and usually generic 18th century-ish.

However, although a lot of other fantasy and SF stuff isn't necessarily imagi-nation just because it's not historical, some is. I can think of the Hyborian campaign and Tolkien's works at one end of the spectrum and Star Wars and GW Backgrounds at the other. They all have their own internal 'logic' and setting which defines them just as much as history does  (only with less grey areas as the documentation and interpretation is defined and limited).

[FierceKitty]

You need only raise the question of whether balrogs can fly to set the nerds arguing for hours.

[Ithoriel]

I suspect we can be just as certain of the capabilities of balrogs as we are of those of many historical troop types. Providing neither the former nor the latter are unduly overpowered I can't say I care much, to be honest.

[FierceKitty]

My point was related to the allegedly fewer grey areas.

[Lord Kermit of Birkenhead]

You need only raise the question of whether balrogs can fly to set the nerds arguing for hours.

African or European Balrogs ?

IanS

[Chad]

Nice one Ian.  😄

[Duke Speedy of Leighton]

Ni!

[Zippee]

My point was related to the allegedly fewer grey areas.

Alledgedly?

you want historical grey areas?

What was a peltast and how did he form up and what weapons was he equipped with - what about an Iphicratean hoplite?

Thureophoroi what were they and what did they look like?

Chariots - what's with the 3rd horse - how does it contribute?

Chariot runners what were they and how much were they paid?

Cromwell 95mm was it worth the build time?

I said fewer not none!

[FierceKitty]

You could effortlessly fill ten pages with similar queries about fantasy issues. Some of them would even be real questions.

[DanJ]

Personally I don't object to imagination based games as essentially all wargames involve the use of one's imagination and the suspension of disbelief (i.e. I can't believe I've just rolled cr*p dice AGAIN!!!).

I've never bothered to build a full imagination campaign, but can see the allure, anything based on history is, of necessity, constrained by the historical geography which can have unfortunate results.  I tried running a Renaissance campaign a few years ago, the rules were fine, the historical setup was good, but the physical limitations of trying to play a campaign from Southern France and Southern Germany down into Sicily proved to be rather constricting for the players.

Players at the out edges could only go one way while those in the middle were beset by enemies.  All very historical, all very real but terribly constraining on the players room for manouver.  An imagination campaign could improve on the player experience by altering the geography to allow more flexibility.

[Zippee]

You could effortlessly fill ten pages with similar queries about fantasy issues. Some of them would even be real questions.

So?

The author can give a definitive answer to any query, that very 'closed box' approach is why so many of the popular game systems are just that game systems with in built definitions, rules and parameters - no debating the finer points of history. It's in the 'codex' and that's that.

Of course they then have to update and change the 'codex' in order to generate more sales, <shrug> that's business.

But unlike historical interests a fantasy or SF background can be written and presented, whole and complete with no uncertainties. Naturally there are backgrounds never written in that way, but like Tolkien written as pseudo-history with open questions, now unanswerable without that same authority at the helm.

There is no period of history that can be presented with 100% certainty, all of it is arguable and questionable to an extent - that's one of its attractions, it's also one of the major things that turns many away.