Korean war update from Rumour Control

[d_Guy]

While I am this mainly for the privies - the Korean War is the ONE thing beyond 1871 that holds my interest. October 1950 to Spring 1951 would be the time period that I would concentrate on. (Although Summer - Fall 1950 would be a good 2nd choice and easier to model I'm thinking.)

[GrumpyOldMan]

Hi

I was just thinking (apart from the hope that the troops could be re-purposed as 1930s Chinese warlord troops ) that a Pony Wars/Science vs Pluck (I'm also looking at the original With Pyjamas through the Desert Gilder rules) treatment could be fun. With either a solo or cooperative game having hordes of enemy popping up against the UN troops. You could build communication difficulties, etc into the game. Something to think about once I've stopped blundering about in the Pike and Shot period.

Cheers

GrumpyOldMan

[paulr]

Apologies for not going into detail concerning  Aussie, Canadian, French, Belgian, Columbian, Dutch, Turkish, Ethiopian, Indian and ...Thai (I kid you not, US fatigue overall and WW2 Adrian helmet) variations. 

You forgot the New Zealanders, Filipinos, Greeks, and probably others

[Leon]

Once we get back from the show this weekend I'll start putting together some lists for everyone to see.  We can then finetune them with any feedback/suggestions.

[Matt J]

My modest research would suggest four changes of uniform  in the Korean war :

1.  The initial KPA invasion.  KPA in summer gear. Rok in summer gear and passable as US in light belt order - lots of caps.  US as in 1945 kit, Brits in tropical.

2. The first winter of 1950. KPA go winter gear as do ROK.  Brits dig out WW2 smocks and leather jerkins  for 29th Brigade.  October 1950 CPLA enter war winter gear.

3.  Summer of 1951. CLPA in summer wear

4 Winter of 1952 - parkas and well designed gear arrives for UN contingent - the Commonwealth contingent gets the M52 trousers and jacket which will become the M58.  In the summer the 'Hat Horrible' - a peaked field cap was issued, but the practical bush hat or status beret remained. 

Apologies for not going into detail concerning  Aussie, Canadian, French, Belgian, Columbian, Dutch, Turkish, Ethiopian, Indian and ...Thai (I kid you not, US fatigue overall and WW2 Adrian helmet) variations. 

Sounds good. If the budget allowed, Belgians and Turks would be good as extras. The former for Imjin the latter because they were hard b**tards and did alot of fighting (although I confess I'm not fully clued up on their kit and equip)

[Matt J]

Also the yanks need some additional poses

The infantry 'someone shot at us, quick desert the position' pose

And the US marine 'lets retake this position by insane frontal assault because that's what we do' pose

[Sunray]

Also the yanks need some additional poses

The infantry 'someone shot at us, quick desert the position' pose

And the US marine 'lets retake this position by insane frontal assault because that's what we do' pose

This is the bonus of 1950 normal (summer) dress order. We get the WW2 American Infantry figures to beef up what is a weak range in terms of sculpts. The RoK mostly in caps - have a wide range of applications.  From US Rear Echelon to Third World 60s-80s militias.

Just one vehicle missing - the Soviet Gaz 67- if sculpted with a hood if would have WW2 use.  The KPA also had numerous motor cycle combos - some of these were German WW2 machines.

The Korean War will never command the interest of WW2 or even Vietnam.  It has no popular blockbuster  "Bridge too far" or "Full Metal Jacket" epic movies to inspire.   How many Arnhem games did that movie inspire?

  Yet some good movies have come out of South Korea.  Field of Honour or In to the Fire.   If you can tolerate sub titles have a look at Taegukgi on youtube.  A Korean epic in the All quiet on the Western Front genre.  I discovered it whilst teaching Conflict Studies.

That said they will never be on Free View, stimulating wargamers,  however I suggest they will give you a flavour of what the bloody civil war means to the Korean people.

[fsn]

On the film side, the two that stick in my mind are:

"A Hill in Korea" with a great British cast including a very young Michael Caine (who was also military adviser as he fought in Korea) and "Pork Chop Hill"starring Gregory Peck.

There's also "M*A*S*H" and "The Bridges at Toko-Ri" for air buffs.

There are also many, many more including some more recent South Korean ones that I can't remember and some absolutely dismal anti-commie 1950's budget efforts.


As to the range to be produced, might I attempt to educate the Dark Lord in the matter of ova osculation? Perhaps a definite stance on the whole summer/winter/1950/1951/1952 question, with a view to a phase 2 expansion, probably into the other season, should sales of the first range go well? IM not so HO, I think that the period selected should be after the Chinese intervention, and I think that a summer uniform would a) fit better with most gamers' existing scenary and b) be more suitable for other periods/ranges. 

[fsn]

It does seem sensible! Particularly is you make armoires to store them it. The armoires would make wonderful proxies for privies and would be suitable for any period after about 1500!

Guy.....Will you stop encouraging Nobby ? 
He's bad enough, as it is.

Can we get a high-5 smiley?   

[d_Guy]

o/''\o 

[fsn]

Thought o/''\o was Admiral Ackbar?




Side thought - and I'm only asking a question here - would US cold weather Korean Was be suitable for Battle of the Bulge? (For all you King Tiger buffs.)

[Sunray]

Suitability depends on the winter year.  For 1950s winter, some of the Ardennes range  might indeed pass muster, (do the trousers have the para cargo pocket ?),  but as the M1951 issue of clothing gets around to being "issued" the differences are apparent even in 1/150 scale. 

The inter war innovation is the Parka which replaces the WW2 great coat.   The Korean habit of wearing the fibre pile hat UNDER the helmet also dates the figure to that conflict.

[mart678]

M46 nearly done will finish of today and M45 

[Sunray]

M46 nearly done will finish of today and M45 

The poor wee tanks are doomed without infantry supported. Do you hear me Dark Lord..Doomed.

[Techno]

Cheque's in the post, James. 

Cheers - Phil

[Duke Speedy of Leighton]

M46 nearly done will finish of today and M45 

You're not making tanks, your just driving Britain's motorway network,

[mart678]

Dam found out was about to do the M1 problem is there are no L roads or C roads or T roads
M75 and M59 also M108 possibly

[Duke Speedy of Leighton]

M108, awesomely obscure road!
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/M-108_(Michigan_highway)

[fsn]

Musn't forget the SU76 for the North Koreans.

South Koreans had some M8's the Chaffees and M36s from Spring '51.

US used M26 Pershings, M4A3, later the M46 Patton. Also the M39 Armoured Utility Vehicle (APC), M7, M41 SPG.  DUKW, LVT3 and 5(?) used at Inchon. M3 half track and various armed variants.

Brits used Churchill VII (& Crocodile?), Centurions, Cromwells and Oxford Carriers. Dingo, Bren Carriers

Canada had the M4A3E8 and the M10.

I'm guessing most of the UN forces would be using US and/or British equipment.

Artillery was all WWII.

M39


Apart from the LVT, M39, M41 and Oxford carrier, everything in that list is in the Pendraken catalogue or darned near it. The M39 and LVTs would be nice, but there's a lot to go on with.

[d_Guy]

Looking at Korean War histories (like I need more stuff to be interested in - or - in which to be interested)
Read Blair's The Forgotten War some years ago and
seeing that Fehrenbach's is considered a classic (but dated).
Any recommendations for a good read on the subject?