Battle of Jutland C4

[Fenton]

Was looking forward to this but ultimately disappointing

Would have liked more info about the personalities involved rather than lots of sonar  images etc

Ah well

[d_Guy]

I don't get channel 4 so obviously didn't see it BUT here is a very recent, quite excellent video published on YouTube.  It had superb graphics and a nice collection of photos (not just the usual ones). It is only 24 min but packs in a huge amount of information in a very concise way. Most impressive is the narration (by Jellicoe's Grandson) which is the clearest exposition of the battle I have heard (given the time allowed).

I haven't seen this posted yet so wanted to be sure folks here get to see it before the centenary is upon us:

[pierre the shy]

Thanks for that d Guy - very good indeed 

As Paul mentioned we went in to see a refight of the main fleet action that was being played at the local club using GQ3 yesterday.

As enthusiastic naval gamers we are marking the anniversary of Jutland ourselves next weekend with a refight of Beatty and Hipper's "run to the south" using GQ2 rules, which we find play faster and smoother than the later GQ3 version of the rules.

AAR will follow the game.

[paulr]

Thanks d Guy, a very informative summary

I'm looking forward to our "run to the south" next weekend

[Lord Kermit of Birkenhead]

Excellent - many thanks.

We are going to try for the whole battle in a couple of weeks, using "Jutland" by A&A

IanS

[Westmarcher]

Yeah, agreed - that was very good d_guy. The 'Battle of Jutland C4' programme was also good but focused more on the wrecks of Beatty's battlecruisers  so, in that respect, as Fenton says, disappointing for anyone looking at the title 'Battle of Jutland' and expecting a more comprehensive account of the battle itself. In the C4 programme, Beatty did not come out of it as well as Jellicoe, with Beatty being accused of later altering the record when he got Jellicoe's job to make him look better.

Fenton - got a passing look at HMS Caroline when I was in Belfast on Friday but missed out on the Royal Ulster Rifles museum because it was shut on the Saturday (d'oh!). Otherwise had a great time - great pubs (including a visit to the Crown, as recommended)!

[Fenton]

Glad you and your friends had a good time

[Westmarcher]

Yeah, it was thanks. Still things to see so great excuse to go back again.

Crazy thing about the RUR Museum was that I knew it was in Waring Street (same as the hotel) but didn't find it until the Saturday. Where was it? Across the road from the hotel!    [My excuse is that the signage was very discreet, sometimes it was dark, I was in 'group mode,' I had my head down when it was raining, I was p*sh*d ....]

By that point, I had successfully sold it to everyone at breakfast and persuaded them it was a good place to go to only to find out, when we all crossed the road, that it was only open Monday to Friday(!)   

[mart678]

The Naval Wargames Society are doing a re-fight/demo of Jutland on the 31st May at Portsmouth Historic Dockyard I am going down that week so will get to see it

[Subedai]

I watched the C4 programme, found the computer assisted archaeology fascinating but the only major things I didn't know was about Harper charts and Beattie's attempts to doctor the evidence -me not being a real naval buff like some but only having a passing interest. As usual, the powers that be come out whiter than the driven snow as they focussed their malicious attention on Jellicoe as a scapegoat. As far as I am concerned, the new chart evidence was the only real revelation, the rest has been public knowledge for years.

[Fenton]

It would have been nice to see more of the chart

[Ithoriel]

Some pretty graphics with no real explanation of why the proved what was claimed and and a pile of "revalations" that were nothing new all presented in a pretty lacklustre way.

Very disappointed and glad I watched it in catch-up so I could fast forward through the most tedious bits.

[Zippee]

The Naval Wargames Society are doing a re-fight/demo of Jutland on the 31st May at Portsmouth Historic Dockyard I am going down that week so will get to see it

Indeed and I get the thrill of being Scheer for the day

[Zippee]

I watched the C4 programme, found the computer assisted archaeology fascinating but the only major things I didn't know was about Harper charts and Beattie's attempts to doctor the evidence -me not being a real naval buff like some but only having a passing interest. As usual, the powers that be come out whiter than the driven snow as they focussed their malicious attention on Jellicoe as a scapegoat. As far as I am concerned, the new chart evidence was the only real revelation, the rest has been public knowledge for years.

Yeah I wasn't impressed, it was nice to have the Harper charts verified and the explanation for Indefatigable being out of position. Other than that it was pretty dull, even the major theme - an attempt to redeem Jellicoe's reputation - wasn't actually impacted by anything they discovered. All they proved was that Beatty did indeed talk himself up and glossed over a rather iffy performance (in fact displaying all the characteristics Jellicoe found troubling). Nothing in the archaeology or "new charts" had any impact on examining Jellicoe's decision to turn away which is what he was damned for (wrongly IMO).

That we should expect anything more from TV history is what surprised me

An examination into why Scheer thought that having escaped once, turning back into the RN line was a good idea - that I'd like fresh insight on. As far as I can see it's just the exact counter-point to the criticism of Jellicoe.

[Last Hussar]

I haven't seen it, but the comments from wargamers are always the same after a documentary.  You do realise it wasn't for the kind of person who has read a number of books about it.