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Author Topic: Stalingrad 2022  (Read 866 times)
sean66
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« on: 21 September 2021, 09:15:17 AM »

2022 Will be the 80th anniversary of the titanic struggle between Fascist Germany and Bolshevik Russia, Encapsulated
with in the Soviet City bearing the Bolshevik's Leaders Name Stalingrad.
the first drafting's of Operation Blau in the early spring of 1942 made no mention of Stalingrad but Army Group Centre was supposed to cut the Don River.
This changed over the summer months to the German Forces having to take Stalingrad at all costs.
those who follow my rather eccentric gaming know I don't  do things by half. ( I know I've still to finish my D-Day Armies)
so this project will be to follow the German forces trying to take the Red October Factory District.
complete with burnt out workers homes, the railway line and the factory itself.
my main protagonists will be the 369th Croatian Reinforced Infantry Regiment.
more information and a few maps on my blog.
Regards
Sean

 
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Lord Kermit of Birkenhead
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« Reply #1 on: 21 September 2021, 09:16:56 AM »

Sounds good !
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Steve J
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« Reply #2 on: 21 September 2021, 09:28:28 AM »

Looking forward to more on this Smiley.
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Norm
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« Reply #3 on: 21 September 2021, 10:47:43 AM »

Some nice maps on your blog. Looking forwards to seeing your project getting to the the table.
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Heedless Horseman
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« Reply #4 on: 21 September 2021, 11:15:23 AM »

Does sound interesting. Hppe alll goes well.
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fred.
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« Reply #5 on: 21 September 2021, 12:29:06 PM »

Should be a good project, a classic part of the battle.

One part of the Stalingrad campaign that confused me, is why the Germans never tried to cross the Volga away from the city, to clear the far bank, which is where all the Soviet reinforcements were coming from. They seem to forget their normal tactic of avoiding the enemy strong point and encircling in. I know there was the name value in taking Stalingrad, but this could have been done by surrounding it, rather than taking every block one by oneÖ
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sean66
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« Reply #6 on: 21 September 2021, 03:12:26 PM »

Fred the original Operation Blua was to take the Don further down the river to stop
it being used as a resupply route down to the Caucasus.
Stalingrad as an objective was not even mentioned in the first Op Order.
It only became more important after the early summer battles when the Germans didn't capture the
astronomical number of prisoners as in 1941. Then chased the retreating Soviet armies
across the steppe, and then into Stalingrad.
As you said it would of made more sense to send the 4th Panzer Army across the Don and clear the far bank, than send them into the city where the 
Blitzkrieg principles couldn't be upheld. I think part of this was the German side from Hitler down under estimating the Soviet defenders. Also it didn't help that Operation Blau was pushing the two Army groups away from each other. Negating mutual support.
to be fair to the Germans this was the first time that the Soviets actually managed to put up a stiff fight (without the winter weather helping them out).
Regards
Sean
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Ben Waterhouse
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« Reply #7 on: 21 September 2021, 03:46:55 PM »

Currently watching this https://youtu.be/Y7pij02s428
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fred.
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« Reply #8 on: 21 September 2021, 05:45:01 PM »

Perhaps we should be thankful (as on so many occasions) that Hitlerís meddling caused problems. But the earlier German bags of prisoners had come from Blitzkrieg approach.

The Russian counter offensive (was in Saturn?) was exactly what the Germans should have done, a wide envelopment of the city, to isolate the defenders and then whittle them out.

Itís all been a while since I read up on Stalingrad so my memory is a but rusty.

But I do find it is these fairly obvious could haves, that seem to get missed from the analysis in books.
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steve_holmes_11
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« Reply #9 on: 21 September 2021, 07:34:47 PM »

Take a look at a map and you'll see that Stalin/Volgograd sits on a westernmost salient of the Volga that contains most of the crossings (bridge or ferry).

The East bank has very limited transport options, being largely marshland downstream of the city.
Upstream there is one fairly minor road and the river is considerably broader than where it passes through the city.
It's between 1 and 3mk wide al the way north to Saratov (some 300km North).
By contrast the Rhine at Wesel is at most 200 metres wide.

It seems unlikely that the Germans could cross the Volga without capturing a bridge or significant ferries - all exclusive to Stalingrad.

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fred.
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« Reply #10 on: 21 September 2021, 10:04:51 PM »

Thanks Steve - useful info, that Iíd not picked up despite reading a number of books!

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paulr
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« Reply #11 on: 22 September 2021, 09:00:39 AM »

Seconded
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paulr
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« Reply #12 on: 01 October 2021, 08:30:05 PM »

I came across this video today which provides some interesting background

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-LQZnpXy3k" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-LQZnpXy3k</a>
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Lord Lensman of Wellington

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