Scenario objectives

[Zinkala]

Time for the dumb newbie question. In the scenarios when determining who wins things like this are written "The attacker occupies the third of the table nearest the defender." What constitutes occupying? Is it just having units in that section or do you need to have cleared it of the enemy?

[Srpz2116]

Time for the dumb newbie question. In the scenarios when determining who wins things like this are written "The attacker occupies the third of the table nearest the defender." What constitutes occupying? Is it just having units in that section or do you need to have cleared it of the enemy?

It's not a dumb question at all!

I might be wrong (and please someone correct me if there's a specific rule for it) but I normally put it down to a scenario-specific interpretation of what would be the most reasonable real-world outcome in order to arrive at what "occupied" means.

For example, if my force has more troops than opposing troops in the designated area, but those opposing troops are isolated elements of Japanese, then I would say you have to completely clear the area to win.

That would be to represent the often drawn-out and attritional nature of the war in South-East Asia and the Pacific, where Japanese forces would frequently fight to the last man and bullet before they'd even think about surrendering/withdrawing.

On the other hand, if the opposing troops are, say, British forces around Dunkirk in 1940, then I'd argue that you simply needs to outnumber them in the objective area and that would be a win. This would reflect the fact that British troops have been cut-off from their chance of escape and would more than likely surrender rather than die trapped behind enemy lines.

Again, perhaps there's a specific rule for it that someone can enlighten us both about, but that's how I do it anyway - whatever feels most authentic!

[Zinkala]

Good reply but not the best clarification.  I like your examples. The other scenarios we played had obvious objectives. But In our next battle (Exploitation) the kid needs to occupy my 2/3 of the table for a major victory. It seems too easy to just have troops in my zone and kind of tough to wipe me out completely.

[Genom]

A line from BKC2 from the first scenario that includes occupying a third of the table.

To occupy a sector of the table, treat the entire sector as a terrain objective.

This might be a bit much at 3 infantry and a command (p57 Objectives in BKC4) for an entire 3rd of the table so expect them to be targets, but that said it's the same as it was in BKC2.

[Zinkala]

Thanks. That gives me a solid goal to use. I'm the defender so my opponent needs to have 3 infantry and an HQ in my edge 1/3 for a major victory, or the center 1/3 for a minor victory. Minor may not be too hard for him but major may be tricky. I'm consistently losing as canadians vs SS (SS are tough. Who knew?  ) but they were pyrrhic victories for him barely getting the wins after massive losses. 

Next question is about artillery and air assets.  Do you always need to pay the extra 10 points per offboard asset? Or is that only for scheduled support?

[Big Insect]

The extra is for scheduled
Standard assets - e.g. off-table guns  - are just paid for at their list price - but you'll need the appropriate FAOs (&/or Command unit) to order them in.

The question about 'Occupied' is a good one - Genom is correct in what he states.

However, we have played it previously that at least 10% of the on-table units (including at least 1 Command unit - CO or HQ, but ignoring Recce, Recce Support, FAOs, FACs, Snipers and any units with the Expendable or Rear Line special abilities) must be in the 'zone' to count as occupying it. With a minimum of at least 3 infantry units and 1 Command unit.

Hope that helps?

[Zinkala]

Thanks. That does help. I can see it being somewhat situational like Srpz2116 said but at least now I have some solid guidelines. We'll try it with with 3 infantry and an HQ first and see how it turns out. That may be tricky for him because his kampfgruppe only has 6-8 infantry. He's decided he liked the armoured panzer grenadiers so lots of Sdkfzs and a few tanks.

[Big Insect]

Force composition can be critical
I played a game against an opponent with no AA other than what was built into his Command units - I had a mass of Stukas. Bye bye soviet armour!
This is very much a combined arms game - your opponent will need to protect those infantry very well 

[Zinkala]

My 17 year old son that I'm playing against enjoys the game but has complained that it takes a lot of thinking. His 14 year old brother is less into miniature games and has been scared to try. So far we've been keeping the forces simple. An infantry battalion (sometimes less 1 company) each with some support running 3,000 points or so. Not a lot of off board artillery or air support. I've had terrible luck with my FAC/FAOs but it is sweet when they get the good call. I've made him a bunch of AA stands but so far he hasn't used it much. Or needed to as my rockets miss most of the time. With only one FAC allowed and my rolls I'm not sure massed air would do anything.