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| | |-+  German Heer, Normandy June 44 - and the Door Knocker
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Author Topic: German Heer, Normandy June 44 - and the Door Knocker  (Read 578 times)
Captain J Goode
Cadet

Posts: 3


« on: 10 May 2019, 02:44:26 PM »

Gentlemen, Set up a first game yesterday somewhere near Caen with a blocking force of Heer backed up by a couple of Stugs, all in 15mm. The attacking force was a battalion of British Infantry supported by the remains of a Cromwell regiment and a 25pdr battery. There was a Stewart and a Humber AC to experiment with the recce rules.  Back in the day when I painted the Heer their organic AT support was a venerable 37mm ATG complete with the AT grenade. However I notice that the weapon is not on the list. Consequently I used the the stas given for 1940, but resricted the Grenade to AT at 30cm range giving it the effectiveness of an early Faust rather than a Schreck. Any thoughts or has someone already come up with a solution?

Graham
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Steve J
Lieutenant General
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Posts: 7400


« Reply #1 on: 10 May 2019, 08:20:25 PM »

This is all I could find on the old forum when I asked the same question:

http://www.blitzkrieg-commander.com/Content/Forum/Topic.aspx?CategoryID=2&ForumID=58&TopicID=12353&ForumPage=1
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sultanbev
Playtester
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« Reply #2 on: 10 May 2019, 09:54:39 PM »

The StG41 stick grenade had a maximum range of 700m, with effective range of 250m, so 30cm is about right. It's penetration was impressive, so using Panzerfaust stats for hit dice is also about right.

In reality though it had a 50% dud rate I've only recently found out so not sure how you'd deal with that.
They built millions of them from early 1942, so having them as standard for your 1942-43 towed 3.7cm and 4.7cm PAK and 3.7cm flak wouldn't be an issue, but I haven't found out if they were ever fitted to the Sdkfz 251/10. Getting out and standing on the bonnet whilst hanging onto the barrel isn't a cool way to load the stick bomb whilst in combat....

Mark
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Steve J
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« Reply #3 on: 10 May 2019, 10:03:53 PM »

Maybe make it 'Slow Firing' to reflect the effort to load the gun whilst in combat?
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Big Insect
Moderator
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Posts: 478


« Reply #4 on: 14 May 2019, 01:44:44 PM »

All sounds very sensible ... I'll endeavor to ensure we accommodate this in the errata PDF lists.

Many thanks

Mark
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Ithoriel
Lieutenant General
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Posts: 6402



« Reply #5 on: 14 May 2019, 02:51:14 PM »

The StG41 stick grenade had a maximum range of 700m, with effective range of 250m, so 30cm is about right. It's penetration was impressive, so using Panzerfaust stats for hit dice is also about right.

In reality though it had a 50% dud rate I've only recently found out so not sure how you'd deal with that.
They built millions of them from early 1942, so having them as standard for your 1942-43 towed 3.7cm and 4.7cm PAK and 3.7cm flak wouldn't be an issue, but I haven't found out if they were ever fitted to the Sdkfz 251/10. Getting out and standing on the bonnet whilst hanging onto the barrel isn't a cool way to load the stick bomb whilst in combat....

Mark

If you are in a 251 and meet something that needs an AT grenade I would assume it would be fired hastily while the driver reversed at speed!

How about treating it as an upgrade, like a Pzfaust or PIAT.

Stats, say, 6/30. 6 rather than 8 to reflect a percentage of duds?

Takes an action to prepare. (I really, really don't like "Slow Firing" Smiley  )

Once fired the 251 reverts to standard 1/60 stats until the reload action is taken.

Declare at game start if loaded or unloaded.

An artilleryman with a shell might make a good marker to indicate loaded/ unloaded.
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sultanbev
Playtester
Captain
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Posts: 400



« Reply #6 on: 14 May 2019, 03:59:49 PM »

Yes, in my own rules I would say a complete activation halted to load the stick bomb, plus the crew would not have to be suppressed or pinned, although suppressed in my rules is different from suppressed in BKC/CWC. I would give it the full 8D6, but allow the target player a special Dud-prone saving roll, 4-6 negates the hit. Making it an upgrade rather than a standard item is essential. Players might not consider the points expense worth it's randomness.

Mark
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Big Insect
Moderator
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« Reply #7 on: 14 May 2019, 04:56:30 PM »

I'm all for that kind of weapon myself - in CWC we created a special rule for the US Airborne shoulder mounted Flash weapon - which had a tendency to explode occasionally on shooting ... don't roll 2 6's in succession on a fire roll  Shocked Shocked Shocked!!!
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sediment
Playtester
Second Lieutenant
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Posts: 87


WWW
« Reply #8 on: 14 May 2019, 07:50:41 PM »

The Steilgranate spigot round was muzzle loaded, I don't think they were issued to 250 or 251 halftracks with the Pak 36 mounted - not very practical.

Cheers, Andy
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fred.
Major General
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WWW
« Reply #9 on: 14 May 2019, 10:37:38 PM »

I've never seen a photo of one loaded on a h/t

I'm also wondering how they were held in place - you can imagine on a half-track bouncing around cross country your nice muzzle loaded hollow-charge weapon coming loose, and falling off onto the front of your half-track. Lets hope they had a fuse that only armed after travelling a fair distance!
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Ithoriel
Lieutenant General
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Posts: 6402



« Reply #10 on: 15 May 2019, 01:18:18 AM »

I've seen photos of a Hungarian 40M Nimrod fitted with one and of a Grille SPG fitted with the 15cm version but not aware of ever seeing a Hanomag with one.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, however.

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