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Author Topic: Arnhem Project - British Airborne  (Read 4467 times)
Stratoq
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« Reply #15 on: 02 May 2019, 10:41:10 PM »

Thank you very much!

Once I get round to playing some games with them I will explore those options. They seem like a good idea.

Next up will be some German units. A bit harder to piece together what was there but should be rewarding.
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sultanbev
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« Reply #16 on: 02 May 2019, 11:52:28 PM »

Shouldn't British airborne be CV10?

Mark
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Steve J
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« Reply #17 on: 03 May 2019, 06:38:24 AM »

If you look at Market-Garden, the British command at times was quite poor. Of course you could say the same of the US Airborne in the same campaign. Generally I would say that a CV of 9 reflects their overall C&C in both Normandy and Market-Garden. This is of course just my personal opinion.
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Ithoriel
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« Reply #18 on: 03 May 2019, 01:06:03 PM »

I'd agree with that Steve. Their strength was in the quality of their troopers not necessarily the skill of their senior command.

What IS the CV of a CO hiding in a Dutch attic?  Smiley
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Stratoq
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« Reply #19 on: 03 May 2019, 02:33:49 PM »

Have to agree about the commanders. Combined with the problems with radios etc it would be hard to justify a CV of 10 for the CO or a CV of 9 for the HQs.


What IS the CV of a CO hiding in a Dutch attic?  Smiley

Perhaps 0? Cheesy
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Dr Dave
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« Reply #20 on: 03 May 2019, 05:36:07 PM »

No problem with command at bttn level - far from it. Frost, Fitch, Dobie et al all performed very well. Issue is that Brigade and Div leadership get lost for the most critical period in the battle - advancing on to the objective in the face of serious opposition. Without overall direction the div plan falls apart. Hence when 4th Para brigade arrives it all comes as a bit of a shock how badly things are going to many of the junior leaders. Hacket was expecting 50% casualties in the first 2 days and told this to his bttn and coy commanders before they flew in. Correct, but perhaps a little disconcerting?  Sad

Radios? This is a myth promulgated by that bloody film. They all knew the radios would be a problem in the town areas and woods.
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sultanbev
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« Reply #21 on: 03 May 2019, 05:46:33 PM »

In BKC/CWC, is it possible to have CO's with lower CV than the sub-commanders (Bttn HQs in this case)?
There must be cases where individual battalion or company commanders were more motivated and in tune with the battlefield than higher HQs.

Mark
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Dr Dave
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« Reply #22 on: 03 May 2019, 05:58:07 PM »

You are right. But no, not in the rules/lists as written.

You can have a replacement HQ who's better than the casualty he replaces if you roll a 6 (a brilliant rule idea), or a CO who's worse than the one lost on a roll of 1-4. So it might come about that way ... perhaps.
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Stratoq
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« Reply #23 on: 03 May 2019, 08:38:03 PM »

The restricted communications because of the radio issue still hindered the overall command and control even if it was expected. Combined with Urquhart being holed up in the attic, it is clear that there were command issues early in the battle.

That being said I wasn't implying that the Bn. commanders were poor. Unfortunately their lightly armed units were unable to deal with German armoured vehicles, even if many of these vehicles encountered on the first day were half tracks and armoured cars. Certainly the 1st and 3rd Battalions struggled with them and also with the infantry that were rushed to form the blocking lines, hence why they were unable to make it to the Bridge.

IMHO for Blitzkrieg Commander, the British Airborne CO probably shouldn't have a rating of 10. The HQs may have a stronger case for being the higher value of 9. Once I build the forces and get some games in, I might play around with the options for command and see what feels right - as ever this will require more reading but can't complain about that.
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Stratoq
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« Reply #24 on: 05 May 2019, 08:32:07 PM »

Next up is a selection of German units at Arnhem. Starting with Kampfgruppe Von Allworden, which fought the 1st Parachute Battalion on the Amsterdamsweg on the 17th September. This was formed from the remnant of the 9th SS Panzerjager Battalion. It mustered 120 men to fight as infantry, 2 Jagdpanzer IVs and 1 Pak-40 7.5cm ATG with transport for the gun. Although there were only two tanks and one gun, I was keen to buy models for them as I did not have any ATGs for the Germans nor did I own a Jadpanzer IV.





Representing this in BKC, I would look at a list on the lines of this:
1x HQ (CV8)
3x Platoon (Waffen SS)
1x Panzer IV, Jagdpanzer
1x Pak 40, 7.5cm AT
1x Trucks

I would consider fielding the infantry without the veteran rule, given that they were SP gun and AT gun crews fighting as infantry. However they had a huge amount of MG42s available to them so I would want to still keep them with the SS firing value (5).
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mad lemmey
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« Reply #25 on: 05 May 2019, 08:35:09 PM »

Impressive
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mmcv
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« Reply #26 on: 05 May 2019, 09:49:59 PM »

Lovely work, really like the basing!
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Steve J
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« Reply #27 on: 05 May 2019, 10:37:54 PM »

Nice work and I like the history bit as well Smiley.
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Big Insect
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« Reply #28 on: 05 May 2019, 10:46:21 PM »

Very nice.

Might be worth painting up a Sniper Team and weaving them into your project?

On the Command value question. Technically there is nothing to stop a list having a CO with a lower value than an HQ. It's just that I couldn't think of any examples (maybe this is it!).
Having COs and HQs with equal CV values is already in the lists - the 1940's French is a case in question.

Again, for a specific scenario it is perfectly acceptable to 'jiggle about' with the lists to achieve a specific outcome to reflect a historical situation.
I played a game years ago based on the Saving Private Ryan US Airborne scenario - where the CO had died in his glider and was not replaced - his HQs just got on with the job of running the battle.

It's a really interesting project thanks for sharing.
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Stratoq
Cadet

Posts: 36


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« Reply #29 on: 06 May 2019, 08:59:32 AM »

Thank you for compliments.

Itís quite satisfying collecting a historical force, just frustrating at times when there doesnít seem to be much on a particular unit (e.g. the element of the recce battalion that was left behind to support the units to the west of Arnhem).

I noticed the sniper rules in the rule book and would like to give them a go. I think it would be a great addition to the airborne force.

As for command values, I hope to plan a few scenarios for this project and if there is evidence to suggest a particular command unit should have a higher CV than itís CO/CO should have a lower value than its subordinate then I would do this.
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