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Author Topic: Rules Help  (Read 2724 times)
gizmok24
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« on: 12 September 2016, 01:56:11 PM »

Hi i am looking for some help with some warband rules Cheesy

so i just got warband over the weekend and i bought a dwarf and goblin army and have played a few games. and was wondering about some rules
1- rules on sieges i really want in the future to do large siege battle at a castle of wooden fort etc and was wondering the rules for sieges and towers battering rams ladders etc and rules for defenders and attackers.
2- dwarf warrior points value, so a dwarf warrior unit costs a total of 37 points compared to a goblin unit which costs 28 points which seems standard for most armies so basically you are paying 9 points for one extra protection dice and to be honest the points difference seems real steep as i found that the extra protection dice wasn't that useful it was worth so many points as i found myself outnumbered by the goblins and in terms of fighting they are the same to me the 9 points difference seems like a lot the dwarves compared to the goblins and other races just seem under powered as for example the goblins have wolf riders as a core unit at the same points cost as warriors and a lot more options for special units.
3-  consuming rage spell, the goblin spell is just way too powerful i the only way i thought to fix this was it also hurts your own units not just the enemy's.

Thank you for any help and input also love warband as a game its fantastic and the models are amazing ! Smiley
- Louis
« Last Edit: 12 September 2016, 02:00:15 PM by gizmok24 » Logged
Techno
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« Reply #1 on: 12 September 2016, 02:11:27 PM »

First of all......
As that was your first post, a very warm welcome to the forum, Louis.

Sorry.....Personally, I can't help with your questions, but I'm sure someone will be along soon, to give you some help !

Cheers - Phil.
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ianrs54
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« Reply #2 on: 12 September 2016, 02:13:58 PM »

Not me either - but welcome - unless WELSH, otherwise foreign, or Sufern (say in estuarrry accent)

IanS  Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

PS - I don't like scots much either. 
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d_Guy
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« Reply #3 on: 12 September 2016, 03:13:55 PM »

Welcome to the forum! Some knowledgeable folks should be along soon.
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mad lemmey
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« Reply #4 on: 12 September 2016, 04:45:43 PM »

Hello and welcome!

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« Reply #5 on: 13 September 2016, 08:59:01 AM »

Hello and welcome to the madhouse.

While I know nothing about the Warband rules, I will say that in my experience with any rule set it best to play several games, as the anomalies you have seen may well balance out over several games.  It also hlps I you play against different players as again this tends to average out play styles.

If then you don't like certain aspects, introduce a house rule, just be careful as it may have a knock on  effect elsewhere

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Chieftain
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« Reply #6 on: 20 September 2016, 10:25:24 AM »

Hi Louis, and welcome.  You raise some good points, which I’ll address in turn.  This’ll go on a bit so brace yourself!  Hehe...

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so i just got warband over the weekend

Well done that man!

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and i bought a dwarf and goblin army

Good choices for a start.

Quote
1- rules on sieges i really want in the future to do large siege battle at a castle of wooden fort etc and was wondering the rules for sieges and towers battering rams ladders etc and rules for defenders and attackers.

Currently Warband is designed as an “open field” game, as set out the preamble about unit basing.  Units are deployed in field order.  So, for the moment there aren’t “official” rules on fortifications, etc.  Sieges are actually months-long strategic engagements rather than crisis-point fights, but in the spirit of fantasy gaming and movies *cough*Helm’s Deep*cough* I can see why you’d like to do something like storming the walls of a vast city etc.

For the moment, I’d suggest you could fudge things with a few house rules, e.g.

1. Make wall sections 1BW wide, limiting terrain that offer ‘behind defences’ advantage to any unit defending it; 1 Terrain Point.
2. Assume all attacking units are equipped with siege weapons like battering rams, ladders etc.

Quote
dwarf warrior points value, so a dwarf warrior unit costs a total of 37 points compared to a goblin unit which costs 28 points which seems standard for most armies so basically you are paying 9 points for one extra protection dice and to be honest the points difference seems real steep as i found that the extra protection dice wasn't that useful it was worth so many points as i found myself outnumbered by the goblins and in terms of fighting they are the same to me the 9 points difference seems like a lot the dwarves compared to the goblins and other races just seem under powered as for example the goblins have wolf riders as a core unit at the same points cost as warriors and a lot more options for special units.

The points values have been worked out to try to balance the armies.  In general I think they hit the mark?  Hill Dwarf warriors are tough as nails and pointed to reflect that.  I find it interesting that you’ve found their Protection to be underwhelming.  If I may suggest you play a few more games to see if that observation bears out?  In developing the lists and over many games, we found the Hill Dwarves were very tough to beat, and their inherent Protection was a key part of that.  I think it’s also worth considering not just each unit in isolation, but the Warband as a whole.  A few Hill Dwarf warriors units mixed in with units with other abilities are usually a solid bastion that the opponent will struggle to take out.  Let us know how things develop for you through additional games.

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3-  consuming rage spell, the goblin spell is just way too powerful i the only way i thought to fix this was it also hurts your own units not just the enemy's.

In and of itself Consuming Rage is indeed a powerful spell.  In fact, I raised this for discussion here http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,14130.0.html .  Is it too powerful?  Does it need to be errata’ed?

I think there are other spells that can also be very powerful (e.g. Dragon Men’s Wrath of the Prismatic Dragons?) so I think the jury’s still out. 

In any case it’s something you’ll need to deal with as an opponent.  As you mentioned the Hill Dwarves, lets look at a few things you can do to “deal with” the Consuming Rage threat.

The Goblin’s Problems
The Goblin Shaman unit has a couple of problems in relying on the Consuming Rage;

1. Consuming Rage costs 6MP to cast.  Poor shamans can’t cast it.  Average Shamans need to rolla “6” and Good Shamans a “5+”.  It will then take up their whole casting for the turn.  So, its tough to actually cast.
2. To cast it, the Shaman unit has to be within 4BW of the enemy – i.e. be within range of the enemy’s bows...

Hill Dwarf Warband build
The Hill Dwarfs have some unit options to include in their Warband that can seriously make life difficult for that Goblin Shaman hopeful to cast his Consuming Rage.

Spell-crafter and the Anvil of Fate spell.  This spell can be cast twice if needed (3MP per casting) and so can potentially take the Goblin Shaman’s MPs down every turn and prevent Consuming Rage ever being cast.

Archers and Artillery.  If you include these units, the Goblin Shaman is going to have to come into their range and open himself up to some (no doubt consentrated and Command Point boosted) ranged shooting.  With the Shaman’s poor Protection this is a brave move!

Gyrocopters.  OK, first off, the models are made of win and pure distilled awesome, so why not include them anyway!  Secondly, the Goblin Shaman cannot cast spells while locked in melee – the Gyrocopter can make that happen easily.

Hill Dwarf tactics
So, looking at the unit options above, what tactics can you employ to maximise your advantages and minimise the effect of Consuming Rage?

Defence in depth. 
Do you really need to line your dwarves up in a nice neat formation ready to take a hit from the Goblin spell?   Could you think of a deployment and unit position that would be better, to keep many of your units out of range?  Perhaps getting some cheap allies from other lists as blockers or sacrificial units? (Newtmen Warriors?)

Ranged shooting is your friend. 
Something I think that is often overlooked is that enemy units do not block your shooting...they do however impose a -1d6 penalty on the shooting attack.  So you archers, and more importantly, any artillery you happen to bring along, are able to target (and with some Command Inspiration) take out any goblin Shaman units lurking in the backfield, waiting to roll that golden six on its Magic Points.  Hopefully by then, your valiant Hill Dwarf cannons will have pulverised him!

Our main weapon is speed.  Surprise and speed..our TWO main weapons are... 
Remember those Gyrocopters, or Noble Riders (or indeed any other fast moving allied or mercenary units you may have included)?  Well, with enough Command Points, you can technically charge them into melee combat with the shaman from turn one.  This is easy if the Goblin player has exposed his Shaman, but can still be achieved if the Shaman is skulking in the backfield.  You’ll probably lose the brave unit you send forwards, but for the chance to keep the Shaman out of the fight for a couple of turns it may be worth it.

Given all that, is Consuming Rage really that “overpowered” when viewed in context of what you can do to counter it?

Incidentally, having played Hill Dwarves against Goblins many times, there is a unit combo and tactic in the Goblin army that I’m more afraid of (and have lost more games to) than the Consuming Rage spell...  I’ve yet to find a way to effectively counter that little doozy... Cheesy

Quote
Thank you for any help and input also love warband as a game its fantastic and the models are amazing !

Good to hear you’re enjoying your foray into the wonderful 10mm world of Warband.  Cheesy
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fred.
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« Reply #7 on: 20 September 2016, 12:31:59 PM »

I've never been a big fan of powerful spells (or other effects) that only happen on a 6

You obviously can't plan around getting the 6 but if you do you have the chance to cause mayhem.
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gizmok24
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« Reply #8 on: 21 September 2016, 02:41:28 AM »

Thanks so much to everyone for the warm welcome Cheesy
And i really appreciate all the rules help i will continue playing with my dwarves and see how i get on
just ordered a wood elf army so will see how they do against them Tongue thanks again
- Louis
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