Pendraken Miniatures Forum

Pendraken Releases, Requests and Photos! => 2012 Releases => Topic started by: Leon on 01 May 2012, 12:16:14 AM



Title: May Releases!
Post by: Leon on 01 May 2012, 12:16:14 AM
After a short break last month for the move to our new premises, we're back with some new 10mm goodness to tempt you with!  First up in this month's batch is the next load of League of Augsburg codes, with the firing troops and the first of the grenadier variants.  There's also the addition of some scythemen, essential for anyone wanting to game Sedgemoor.   ;)

The second part of this month's releases is a couple of useful French WWII vehicles, in the form of the Panhard A/C, and the Unic P107 halftrack.  The latter of these two came in several variants, all based on the Kegresse patent, so we'll be sending the model back to the designer for a few conversions.

We'll also have a special 'Mid-month' release in the next couple of weeks, as we completely revamp the Sci-Fi range, with new Marines, new heavy weapons, and some special new odds and ends!  10mm Sci-Fi is where it's at...  :D

So here's the official list:

League of Augsburg
LOA12 - Flintlock firing line
LOA13 - Matchlock firing line
LOA14 - Grenadiers, fur hats, advancing
LOA15 - Grenadiers, cloth caps, standing
LOA16 - Scythemen


(http://www.pendraken.co.uk/ImageBin/April%20Releases.jpg)



WWII
French
FRE13 - Panhard A/C
FRE14 - Unic P107 Halftrack


I've only got a couple of masters pics of these, as I've not had chance to blackwash any of them...  :-[ )
(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7168/6439348829_9521c68a1c.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/pendraken/6439348829/)

(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7205/6850571953_a7d3eb59b1.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/pendraken/6850571953/)

Hope you like them!

 8)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Shecky on 01 May 2012, 05:14:48 AM
Like them all.  8)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: nikharwood on 01 May 2012, 07:40:24 AM
Like them all.  8)


Ditto...'specially those scythe men - funnily enough, I'll be driving past Westonzoyland today (possibly swimming past actually, looking at the rainfall)  8)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: AndyT on 01 May 2012, 07:52:32 AM
...
We'll also have a special 'Mid-month' release in the next couple of weeks, as we completely revamp the Sci-Fi range, with new Marines, new heavy weapons, and some special new odds and ends!  10mm Sci-Fi is where it's at...  :D

Is the "sci fi dungeon" still on your to-do list?

Cheers, Andy


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: mad lemmey on 01 May 2012, 08:16:16 AM
Plus there is a special fantasy figure Techno has done up for me on his way Leon!  :D


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Hertsblue on 01 May 2012, 09:36:43 AM
What I want to know is - why are all the nicest figures in the ranges I'm never going to get round to doing?  :(


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Wkeyser on 01 May 2012, 09:52:06 AM
I love the line "first set of varitions for the grenadiers"  boy that promises even more of those great looking grenadiers.

A freind of mine picked up some of the Firing figures at Salute and they are all the same high standard as the earlier figs. Great stuff. I cannot wait unitl we see the artillery and Cav. I would love the head varitions as I am already planning on doing quite a few head swaps with the Greandiers.

Thanks Leon and Clib.
William


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Squirrel on 01 May 2012, 12:05:06 PM
Some cracking stuff there Leon! The Unic P107 half-track has been on my want list for a while, and those LoA are gorgeous! Hard to resist though I know sod all about the period  :-S

Looking forward to see what's coming for sic-fi.

Cheers,

Kev


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Dave T on 01 May 2012, 12:14:39 PM
Yet another nice looking period to look into!   I hate being tempted into having yet another army on the go.

Any view on when the new ACW figures may be available so I might at least get one job done (750 figs done 400 to go for my target)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Sussex.john on 01 May 2012, 12:52:57 PM
I'm also interested in some news on dates for the ACW figures


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Leon on 01 May 2012, 01:39:55 PM
Is the "sci fi dungeon" still on your to-do list?

Looking forward to see what's coming for sic-fi.

The Sci-Fi modules have taken a bit of a back seat at the moment, but I think I might take them up to Falkirk with us this weekend and get some more work done on them.  They wouldn't be ready in time for the revamp, but maybe June/July's releases.

I love the line "first set of varitions for the grenadiers"  boy that promises even more of those great looking grenadiers.

Clib can confirm better than me, but I believe these two initial codes will be converted and 'swopped' over as it were, so cloth caps advancing and fur hats standing, plus any others he's planning to do.

I'm also interested in some news on dates for the ACW figures

Any view on when the new ACW figures may be available so I might at least get one job done (750 figs done 400 to go for my target)

The ACW is next on the list of releases, so I'll be getting most of the figures master moulded this week and next, with a view to getting the bulk of the foot codes all released in June's batch.


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: mollinary on 01 May 2012, 05:47:09 PM
LoA cavalry next!  Or I'll shcreeamm and shcreeamm and shcreeamm until I'm sick!  I'm serious!!!!!!

VEB aka Mollinary


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: ianrs54 on 01 May 2012, 07:29:01 PM
Or I'll shcreeamm and shcreeamm and shcreeamm until I'm sick!  I'm serious!!!!!!


The bag is in the pocket on the seat in front Violet Elithabet.......

IanS  :D


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Blaker on 01 May 2012, 09:52:18 PM
These look great!   :D

Now just remember the Aztecs and Mayans need to be finished before December 21, 2012 so the world will not be destroyed   :d  :d


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Derbo on 01 May 2012, 11:18:31 PM

Great new things!

Quote
LoA cavalry next!  Or I'll shcreeamm and shcreeamm and shcreeamm until I'm sick!  I'm serious!!!!!!
Made my day! (but I´m feeling the same :D)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: maciek on 02 May 2012, 04:42:15 PM
Great stuff.
Looking forward for more from LoA.


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Hertsblue on 03 May 2012, 08:32:34 AM

Now just remember the Aztecs and Mayans need to be finished before December 21, 2012 so the world will not be destroyed   :d  :d

As the world's going to be destroyed anyway, is there much point?  :d


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: mart678 on 03 May 2012, 10:03:04 PM
Of course there is a point as you can only bring with you to the after life the wargames armies you own so imagine eternity with 1 army AAAGGHHHHH!!!!!


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: rexhurley on 04 May 2012, 12:16:19 AM
As the world's going to be destroyed anyway, is there much point?  :d
You do realise that the world is only going to come to an end because some Spaniard ran a sword through the scribes back as he was chiselling away at the calendar tablet dont you  :d :d ;)

Mind you if it does end then I won't have to worry about getting up for work eh!  :-\


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Chad on 04 May 2012, 09:21:13 AM
What pees me off is that I will only have 2 months to enjoy my retirement!  >:( :'(

Chad


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Hertsblue on 04 May 2012, 09:26:08 AM
What pees me off is that I will only have 2 months to enjoy my retirement!  >:( :'(


Hope you enjoy it - I certainly do.  <:-P


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Chad on 04 May 2012, 01:32:31 PM
Cheers HB


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Martyn on 04 May 2012, 09:14:10 PM
Panhard Armoured Car

Is this a serious "master" it looks so shoddy? No detail. This is a backward step or was it just "banged out"to satisfy a few people on the Pendraken Forum? Come on Pendraken, look at what is being done in 6mm by GHQ. I did the Yom kippur Game at Salute using GHQ because Pendraken did not respond and the quality of GHQ is excellent. I realise that Pendraken forum members will condemn this heresy but I am a potential customer and I don't like what I see. I don't expect you to reconsider but if a company only listen to followers but customers then that company dies. ( The kings new clothes comes to mind)  Please raise your game on the detail side. Your in charge of your designers ?????

I only expect negative response from the forum to this, but I run a business and I can't afford to be weak when a supplier delivers second rate. It's sent back.


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Maenoferren on 05 May 2012, 12:54:26 AM
Having never seen a Panhard Armoured car in my life, i wouldnt know one if it ran over my foot, so I cant pass comment. However I would say you are more likely to get negative comments from the tone of your message. If you dont like something, no big deal, there are some figures I dont like, prehaps if you didnt like it you could have said so in a different way.
Yep some may see your comment as heresy, however, I would suggest a lot more see it as bit rude and heavy handed.
obviously this is my view and cannot be read as anyone elses.
cheers
Steve


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: GordonY on 05 May 2012, 07:35:46 AM
While the quality of GHQ is indeed excellent, so is the fecken price!! That and its too damn small for these ageing eyes and stubby fingers.

The Panhard looks perfectly ok to me and I will be having a few as recce units at some point. Rarely will a master knocked up out of plasticard and green (yellow) stuff look anywhere near as good as the production metal once its had a coat of paint. Even my slap dash paint jobs look good enough for government work on my Pendraken armies.


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Derek H on 05 May 2012, 07:54:40 AM
While the quality of GHQ is indeed excellent, so is the fecken price!! That and its too damn small for these ageing eyes and stubby fingers.

The Panhard looks perfectly ok to me and I will be having a few as recce units at some point. Rarely will a master knocked up out of plasticard and green (yellow) stuff look anywhere near as good as the production metal once its had a coat of paint. Even my slap dash paint jobs look good enough for government work on my Pendraken armies.

The GHQ stuff has massively exaggerated detail.  Huge rivets where at 1/300 you should barely be able to see the things.

It's a look some people really like but I prefer my models to be more realistic.


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Ben Waterhouse on 05 May 2012, 10:22:26 AM
Well I will wait until I see the actual casting before judging.

Oh and by the way I think people who run businesses ought to invest in a little more customer service...

There happened to be an enthusiastic buyer of a certain company's rules who whilst visiting Salute and wanting to purchase some more spent a good while being ignored several times; as the purveyor was too busy shooting the breeze with a pal = no sale...  ;)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: fred. on 05 May 2012, 10:22:59 AM
This is another manufacturers 10mm Panhard

(http://www.kerynne.com/games/images/French/tanks/IMG_3193.JPG)

And here's a real one
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/78/AMD_Panhard_178_Saumur.jpg)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: fred. on 05 May 2012, 10:26:08 AM
So it would seem some rivet heads should be visible, but probably smaller than then on the other 10mm model?


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Chad on 05 May 2012, 11:13:33 AM
Martyn

I don't know about other forum members, but I find the comments regarding Pendraken customer service well off the mark.

I have found them to be nothing but supportive and to my mind go out of their way to meet customer requests.

As someone once said you cannot please all the people all the time and very few business can achieve that.

What did they not respond to?

As to the modellers, Leon has pointed out many times, many of them do not work exclusively for Pendraken nor in 10mm scale. They are all, I believe, self-employed and therefore are suppliers and not employees. In your business are you in charge of your suppliers?

Chad
 :(






Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Rob on 05 May 2012, 01:05:33 PM
Martyn

I don't know about other forum members, but I find the comments regarding Pendraken customer service well off the mark.

I have found them to be nothing but supportive and to my mind go out of their way to meet customer requests.

As someone once said you cannot please all the people all the time and very few business can achieve that.

What did they not respond to?

As to the modellers, Leon has pointed out many times, many of them do not work exclusively for Pendraken nor in 10mm scale. They are all, I believe, self-employed and therefore are suppliers and not employees. In your business are you in charge of your suppliers?

Chad
 :(

I would second this comment; as a seller Pendraken will be presented with potential products and will decide whether to take them or not. I presume they have input in  a general way on the ranges they would be interested in to give the designers a steer. If the resulting master is not good enough it will be rejected. An example of this is the Napoleonic infantry loading his musket which although he looked good had his musket (as pointed out by forum members) in the wrong position. We are still waiting for his replacement (Leon?), so the system is in place.

Having said all that the wheels on the master do look rather simple, but this may not be their final look.

Cheers, Rob  :)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Derek H on 06 May 2012, 04:21:19 PM
Well I will wait until I see the actual casting before judging.

I saw it at Carronade yesterday and it was fine. 


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Martyn on 07 May 2012, 05:33:28 PM
Well it was so predictable the responses so far. To answer a few questions that forum members have raised.
a) So what if the designer is freelance. If the product is not up to standard then it's not.
b) In my business I know my customers would not expect second best and I don't from my suppliers.
c) I ensure my suppliers have detailed specifications of what is required before placing an order. I don't know what Pendraken does?
d) I would like to thank one member for raising the quality of the wheels of the Panhard. Its the thing I find most offensive. NO detail.They are blobs of putty with a lop-sided "fried egg" on top.
e) As for cost: GHQ is £7.00 for five. Pendraken works our at £10.50 for 5.
f) GHQ work to a scale of 1/285th? 10mm is not a scale.

It's easy for me I will not buy as I don't like second best.

Compare the Panhard to the Augsburg figures. Now there is something nice and I will buy as soon as the cavalry and artillery have been produced.


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Leon on 08 May 2012, 02:17:26 AM
I go away for one show, and it all kicks off...  :D

Panhard Armoured Car

Is this a serious "master" it looks so shoddy? No detail. This is a backward step or was it just "banged out"to satisfy a few people on the Pendraken Forum? Come on Pendraken, look at what is being done in 6mm by GHQ. I did the Yom kippur Game at Salute using GHQ because Pendraken did not respond and the quality of GHQ is excellent. I realise that Pendraken forum members will condemn this heresy but I am a potential customer and I don't like what I see. I don't expect you to reconsider but if a company only listen to followers but customers then that company dies. ( The kings new clothes comes to mind)  Please raise your game on the detail side. Your in charge of your designers ?????

I only expect negative response from the forum to this, but I run a business and I can't afford to be weak when a supplier delivers second rate. It's sent back.

First off, I think that's quite a strong reaction to a couple of pics of a master.  In real life the model looks fine, and the people who have seen the metal version at the shows so far haven't had any problems with it.  The actual vehicle itself didn't have much going on, so a 1:150th scale version isn't going to be covered in details.  The only thing I could see maybe being an issue is the wheels, but they don't look too bad on the castings.

As to the modellers, Leon has pointed out many times, many of them do not work exclusively for Pendraken nor in 10mm scale. They are all, I believe, self-employed and therefore are suppliers and not employees. In your business are you in charge of your suppliers?


The designer of this one is a full-time modeller/painter with his own business, and also designed our Char 2C, the Renault R35, the Protz trucks, and the Unic P107 also seen in this months releases.  As far as design spec goes, we tell him which vehicle we need, supply the scale drawings if needed, and away he goes.  That's the same for most of our vehicle designers.

Oh and by the way I think people who run businesses ought to invest in a little more customer service...

There happened to be an enthusiastic buyer of a certain company's rules who whilst visiting Salute and wanting to purchase some more spent a good while being ignored several times; as the purveyor was too busy shooting the breeze with a pal = no sale...  ;)

Now as we don't sell rules, I know this wasn't us, so you've got me intrigued now!

 :D


An example of this is the Napoleonic infantry loading his musket which although he looked good had his musket (as pointed out by forum members) in the wrong position. We are still waiting for his replacement (Leon?), so the system is in place.

We've not replaced him yet, it's been put on the back burner.  I think we'll do a few variants once we get the bulk of the Wagram stuff done, but not one for every troop type.


Well it was so predictable the responses so far. To answer a few questions that forum members have raised.
a) So what if the designer is freelance. If the product is not up to standard then it's not.
b) In my business I know my customers would not expect second best and I don't from my suppliers.
c) I ensure my suppliers have detailed specifications of what is required before placing an order. I don't know what Pendraken does?
d) I would like to thank one member for raising the quality of the wheels of the Panhard. Its the thing I find most offensive. NO detail.They are blobs of putty with a lop-sided "fried egg" on top.
e) As for cost: GHQ is £7.00 for five. Pendraken works our at £10.50 for 5.
f) GHQ work to a scale of 1/285th? 10mm is not a scale.

I'm not sure how the GHQ price comparison fits in?  You can get them in 15mm at £30 for 5 as well?

The scale we work to is 1:150th, that's what we've used for a very long time now.  There is probably some slight variation to that in some vehicles where different designers have done them, but it's not much.

 8)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Luddite on 09 May 2012, 01:39:36 PM
Well it was so predictable the responses so far.

Did you expect your hostile, antagonistic and rude post to illicit favourable responses?

 :o

To be honest, i'd say the esteemed forumites, and indeed our Pendraken overlord (all hail the 10mm god) has responded in a most polite and restrained way given the provocation!

 ;)

Quote
a) So what if the designer is freelance. If the product is not up to standard then it's not.

Ours is an amateur hobby in its truest, traditional sense.  Skilled freelancers abound, even among those eking a living out of our little lead toys.  Many 'freelancers' i've encountered actually push out higher quality than many of the so called 'professionals.  

However, if there's something not up to your personal standard, then may i suggest you take the sensible approach of not buying them?!  I find it works quite well for me, so i'd reccomend it to you.

Quote
b) In my business I know my customers would not expect second best and I don't from my suppliers.

That's an impressive and laudible business imperitive.  Wargaming products run the gamut, from 'cheap and cheerful' (i'm sure we all know who these chaps are) to 'its gorgeous, but are you kidding on the price tag?!?' (again, no names needed).

This is highly useful as it allows the customer (e.g. me) to make a decision about what quality i want and what i'm willing to pay.  

Therefore i would suggest that there's actually no such thing as 'second best' in the toy soldier market.  In most cases you get what you're willing to pay for.  Obviously, businesses want to dominate the market and most appear to strive to maximise their quality while minimising their price (although sometimes you wonder!  ;D )

I've found Pendraken generally gives good quality at great price, and with excellent customer service.  

How they deal with their, as far as i'm aware, 'contracted' designers is a mystery to me (and long may it remain so), but i think if you look at the recent 'upgrades' (Sci fi, AVBCW, Roma, Falklands, Napoleonics, etc., etc. they are definately doing something right!   :D

Quote
c) I ensure my suppliers have detailed specifications of what is required before placing an order. I don't know what Pendraken does?

As i said, me neither...other than the fact that the designers are often on here, posting up WIPS for comment, positiive feedback, and improvement suggestions.  The Napoleonic chap with his odd reloading posture, the changes to the Roman range, the comments on the Falklands chaps, etc. show that Pendraken, its designers, and indeed its customers are engaged in a positive, successful design process that seems to produce stuff that people actually want to buy.

I'm struggling to think of another producer (toy soldier or otherwise) that does this?

Quote
d) I would like to thank one member for raising the quality of the wheels of the Panhard. Its the thing I find most offensive. NO detail.They are blobs of putty with a lop-sided "fried egg" on top.

'Offensive'?!?!?!

Good grief.  Are you sure?  

This offends you?

That's worrying.   :(  You know its just a toy car right?

It also appears to be a master, and these things are always subject to change.  Those who've seen the metal product seem to be of the opinion its isn't quite so 'offensive'?

Quote
e) As for cost: GHQ is £7.00 for five. Pendraken works our at £10.50 for 5.

The only democracy in Capitalism is the power of the money vote.  If you can find what you like elsewhere for a price you prefer, well...we all make our consumer choices.  Personally, for overall quality/price/service i default to PEndraken.  

If they did 15mm, 20mm and 28mm figures too i'd never buy from another supplier...

That's my choice.  I certainly wouldn't complain to anyone about their pricing...if i think its over the odds i'll simply go elsewhere.  Even with the 'Evil Empire'....(damn those new Necrons are tempting... >:( ).   ;D

 
Quote
f) GHQ work to a scale of 1/285th? 10mm is not a scale.

Wait, what?!?!

10mm sir is the ONLY scale.  the scale against which all other scales are measured.  Admittedly its measured in 'new money', not proper Imperial, but you can't have everything...

Quote
It's easy for me I will not buy as I don't like second best.

I refer the honourable member to my previous comments...

Quote
Compare the Panhard to the Augsburg figures. Now there is something nice and I will buy as soon as the cavalry and artillery have been produced.

Ah yes...another great benefit of Pendraken...they strive for and often achieve comprehensive and complete ranges wherever possible  nothing worse than only being able to purchase half of what you need because its not been produced (yet).  Funnily enough there are a couple of projects i'm holding off on due to 'pending releases' (and other committments of course...will i EVER get these FPW French done?!?!   :'(  )...


Overall Martyn, i'd say constructive criticism is welcomed by everyone.  I'd suggest that might be a better approach to take in future.   ;)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Chad on 09 May 2012, 04:41:53 PM
Luddite

Excellent response.

I must admit that my intended response would probably have been somewhat less restrained than yours.

I managed to restrain myself however.  :-X

Chad


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Ben Waterhouse on 09 May 2012, 07:07:33 PM
Bravo Luddite.


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: mollinary on 09 May 2012, 07:40:15 PM
Luddite.

Well done.  A perfectly moderated reponse.  I found Martin's tone particularly difficult to understand because Pendraken's approach to customer service, and input to the production process, is one which I do not see elsewhere in the hobby. There are plenty of good suppliers out there, offering us great service.  But Pendraken go the extra yard. On Martyn's particular comment on the Panhard, I would probably
agree that the wheels need some work, but why that prompted the diatribe I cannot guess.  Anyway, I remain a satisfied customer.

Mollinary


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: mad lemmey on 09 May 2012, 09:22:26 PM
Luddite,
 =D>
Thank you for a reasoned arguement
Mad Lemmey


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: GordonY on 09 May 2012, 09:24:06 PM
To be honest I found the tone a bit offensive, after all, if he doesnt like it I dont see a Pendraken sturmtrooper holding a Luger to his head forcing him to buy them.


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Gandalf on 10 May 2012, 08:35:51 AM
Top job Luddite.  You saved me from telling Martyn to wind his neck in!  ;D


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Luddite on 10 May 2012, 03:52:48 PM
Top job Luddite.  You saved me from telling Martyn to wind his neck in!  ;D

We'll call yours the précis !   ;D 


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Squirrel on 10 May 2012, 09:03:20 PM
It's a shame Martyn didn't make his comment on Frothers .... I could have had free rein to respond with the few choice words that first sprang to mind   :d

Cheers,

Kev


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Martyn on 11 May 2012, 09:12:51 PM
Thank you Leon for your reply and you are right all businesses are the same my apologies.

Congratulations Luddite you have proved my point. By the way 10mm is not a scale no mater how you might like phase it!


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Luddite on 12 May 2012, 09:51:27 AM
Congratulations Luddite you have proved my point.

You were making a point?

Which point did i prove?

Quote
By the way 10mm is not a scale no mater how you might like phase it!

Really?

Scale

1.
a. A system of ordered marks at fixed intervals used as a reference standard in measurement: a ruler with scales in inches and centimeters.
b. An instrument or device bearing such marks.
c. A standard of measurement or judgment; a criterion.
2.
a. A proportion used in determining the dimensional relationship of a representation to that which it represents: a world map with a scale of 1:4,560,000.
b. A calibrated line, as on a map or an architectural plan, indicating such a proportion.
c. Proper proportion: a house that seemed out of scale with its surroundings.
3. A progressive classification, as of size, amount, importance, or rank: judging divers' performances on a scale of 1 to 10.
4. A relative level or degree: entertained on a lavish scale.
5. A minimum wage fixed by contract: musicians playing a benefit concert for scale.
6. Mathematics A system of notation in which the values of numerical expressions are determined by their places relative to the chosen base of the system: the decimal scale.
7. Music An ascending or descending collection of pitches proceeding by a specified scheme of intervals

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/scale (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/scale)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Martyn on 12 May 2012, 07:53:55 PM
Well Luddite
The point was that anyone who dare be critical of a pendraken release on this forum is bound to have the wrath of the faithful come down upon them. Obviously you failed to take in this when reading my initial posting.

By the the way, 10mm is still not a scale. Why not buy yourself a micrometer and measure some 10mm models against actual measurements. It would save all your righteous definitions but 10mm is still not a scale if it were then it could be measured accurately.

Martyn


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Luddite on 12 May 2012, 10:42:47 PM
Well Luddite
The point was that anyone who dare be critical of a pendraken release on this forum is bound to have the wrath of the faithful come down upon them. Obviously you failed to take in this when reading my initial posting.

Good grief.   =)

OK, look...since you just don't seem to get it, i'll be blunt and say you're wrong.  There's lots of criticism on here.  ITs just constructive.

Criticism of Roman shield sizes http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,4443.0.html (http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,4443.0.html)  Constructive criticism.

Criticism of Falklands chaps postures http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,4378.0.html (http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,4378.0.html)  Constructive criticism.

Criticism of Roman posture http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,2505.15.html (http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,2505.15.html)  Constructive criticism.  I'll also point you to reply 24 - my criticism.

There are many, many more examples, endless moaning about the lack of website photos, moaning on about Tarletons and more tanks.  
Criticism abounds here...but its almost all constructive.

Why?  Because Pendraken give excellent service, produce great toys, and customers like me want them to get things right.  Mostly they do.  

Griping on like you did is rude, unpleasant, simply creates antagonism and achieves nothing positive.

Had you phrased your criticism constructively, this thread would not have derailed as it has...

Quote
By the the way, 10mm is still not a scale. Why not buy yourself a micrometer and measure some 10mm models against actual measurements. It would save all your righteous definitions but 10mm is still not a scale if it were then it could be measured accurately.

Martyn

It clearly is.

Not my 'righteous definition' (i really don't know what you're on about here), but a simply dictionary definition.  10mm is a criterion of size among other sizes, therefore clearly a scale.  I'm sorry that you don't see it, but, well, 'there are some folks that if they don't know, nobody can tell them'...


You may have the final word, should you wish to continue with this negative discourse, since i'm done with you.

Apologies to Pendraken and the other forumites for indulging this unpleasantness.   :( :-[


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Gandalf on 12 May 2012, 11:10:53 PM
Martyn
Is there a GHQ forum you could be trolling instead of this one??


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Leon on 13 May 2012, 01:07:38 AM
Thank you Leon for your reply and you are right all businesses are the same my apologies.

I'm not sure where I said all businesses are the same?

Without dragging this all out further than it needs to, we take all feedback on board and make changes where necessary.  If concerns had been raised when the original pictures of the model were shown, then we could have easily sent it away to be tweaked a bit.  To do that now means over £100 worth of sculptor / moulding costs, which as a business owner yourself will understand isn't viable for a single complaint, especially when from the theme of your messages so far, you'd be unlikely to buy it anyway. 

It's impossible to please 100% of people, but if we can hit 99%, then we're doing well.  We've sold dozens of these so far, and no-one's complained about any of them.

All that being said, Dave's still considering spending the money and changing the vehicle, because we still want to try and hit that 100% satisfaction.


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Blaker on 13 May 2012, 02:26:31 AM
I dont know why there is such a fuss about 10mm being a scale or not, whenever I hear the word scale I think of model trains and watching something go round and round. When I hear XXmm I think of miniatures for wargaming, but Hey what do I know, I'm just a Yank from across the pond, er, no not correct, not a Yank, I'm from Texas and just a bull riding cowboy that use to raise hogs and chew tobacco and break noses of the oafs that said discouraging words directed towards my misses or mum, AND I play with toy soldiers   :D   :d

I really like using Pendraken even tho they dont have everything I would like to play with but they sure are making lots of stuff I wanna play with and they listen to pros and cons about their minis and ranges. Can't ask for more than that. They do a great job, and I guess I am a Fan Boy but I dont like everything Pendraken makes, ie, the Amazons. I know lots of people like them, I just dont, I dont complaint about them or be negative about them, so I dont buy them, nuff said.

Sorry Martyn that you have gotten a load of forum members sticking up for Pendraken, it is simple, we like what they are making for our gaming needs and when issues are raised about a figure, they do try to correct it if possible. But slamming them because X is wrong with Y and kinda sticking a tuber up their bum about it kinda ruffled our knickers. And you called it, you thought you would get some crass feedback about your post and I guess you did  :D

I hope that this thread does not crimp your desire to purchase more Pendraken minis because there are lots of their minis that are excellent and really dress up a gaming table.

If you would like to discuss this further with me, please PM me and we can take this off forum so more constructive discussions can get along here  ;)

cya  :)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Aart Brouwer on 13 May 2012, 09:52:08 AM
[...] it is simple, we like what they are making for our gaming needs and when issues are raised about a figure, they do try to correct it if possible.

There you go. Eight hundred and sixty four satistied forum members can't all be wrong. And even if they were, at least they wouldn't be so rude about it.

Cheers,
Aart


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Chad on 13 May 2012, 10:20:20 AM
Like others I do not wish to prolong this discussion.

I just thought given Martyn's view on GHQ an scales I thought one or two people might be interested on the GHQ Panhard P178, the original subject of the post.

I have attached a copy of the image from their website.

Is it just me or, on scaling up the vehicle to actual size, would the rivets as modelled look like inverted frying pans??  :-\

So much for acceptable 'scale' methinks.

Chad (aka a wrathful faithful)  ;)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: quasar42 on 13 May 2012, 12:38:22 PM



All that being said, Dave's still considering spending the money and changing the vehicle, because we still want to try and hit that 100% satisfaction.

If I may, I am not sure that that would be the best thing to do. Obviously, it is worthy of praise that you seek to make everybody happy. But resources are limited and if you invest some of them into this, they will not be available for you to make other great figures. By trying to make one person happy you may therefore make many others unhappy.


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: mollinary on 13 May 2012, 01:03:55 PM

The point was that anyone who dare be critical of a pendraken release on this forum is bound to have the wrath of the faithful come down upon them.

Martyn,

I think that was never the point.  What most people have objected to is the tone of your post, not  the content of your criticism.  I do not know whether it was intentional, but the posts come across as aggressive, arrogant and rude.  This is one of the few forums where such behaviour is unusual, and I hope that remains.  I think if your criticism was expressed in a more constructive manner, it would not have prompted such a response from other members. But perhaps that was your intention?  If so, congratulations, job done!

Mollinary


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: GordonY on 13 May 2012, 03:58:32 PM
Leon, about time this thread was locked perhaps?


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Martyn on 13 May 2012, 04:07:25 PM
My apologies to everyone for the tone of my initial e-mail.



regards

Martyn


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: mollinary on 13 May 2012, 05:38:51 PM
Martyn,

That is a handsome gesture, and I think, at least from my personal point of view, draws a neat line under this thread.

Best Regards,

Mollinary


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Ben Waterhouse on 13 May 2012, 06:00:32 PM
Indeed, it takes a Big Man (Copyright Lardies) to apologise.
My respects Martyn

Ben


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Chad on 13 May 2012, 08:39:28 PM
Agreed Ben.

Let's put in behind us.

Chad


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Luddite on 14 May 2012, 12:55:35 AM
Spoken like a gentleman Martyn.

 =D> :)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Leon on 14 May 2012, 03:12:25 AM
My apologies to everyone for the tone of my initial e-mail.

No worries, let's all get back to some gaming!

 8)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: FierceKitty on 14 May 2012, 03:34:36 AM
Group hug, everyone!


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: mad lemmey on 14 May 2012, 01:12:42 PM
Just how civilised is this place! Nice one all round! :)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Martyn on 14 May 2012, 02:45:07 PM
Perhaps I might suggest that from this discourse something positive might be gained. In truth I think the Panhard AC is let down by its wheels. Perhaps to improve the detail on future releases of wheeled vehicles Pendraken might consider making and casting, say three different sizes of detailed masters (for small, medium and large vehicles). Probably making a set of wheels from scratch is a pain trying to get each one round and the same.  These could then be sent out to the chaps who are making the initial models and then simply fitted into position.  It would have the advantage being already detailed and make for quicker turn rounds on completed masters?

regards

Martyn


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Leon on 14 May 2012, 02:58:13 PM
Perhaps I might suggest that from this discourse something positive might be gained. In truth I think the Panhard AC is let down by its wheels. Perhaps to improve the detail on future releases of wheeled vehicles Pendraken might consider making and casting, say three different sizes of detailed masters (for small, medium and large vehicles). Probably making a set of wheels from scratch is a pain trying to get each one round and the same.  These could then be sent out to the chaps who are making the initial models and then simply fitted into position.  It would have the advantage being already detailed and make for quicker turn rounds on completed masters?

Getting the wheels all the same (and all round!) is indeed tricky, and your suggestion is definitely something we've considered in the past, and something which we'd like to do in the future.  I'm not sure how many different sizes we'd need, as there are a lot of variations used over the years, but 'wheel dollies' as it were, would be a good thing.

 8)


Title: Re: May Releases!
Post by: Techno on 14 May 2012, 04:47:11 PM
I don't know whether the following would work....as it slows things down for the designer..... :'(
And would give Pendraken 'extra' moulding and casting tasks !! :'(
But......How about the designer just making a single wheel....sending it in.... and having multiples returned ?.

I've certainly used a similar method in the distant past when doing certain Mechs for Ral P.....They didn't need wheels but occasionally  certain bits could be duplicated for parts of left and right limbs, as they were effectively identical....Get them sent back....Pin them together. ...Took time post wise...But....
Much easier to do it that way, rather than spend hours of extra modelling to make the left and right sides look as identical as possible. 
!
I know wheels are a different matter to multi casting things like shields, muskets etc which could potentially be used dozens of times on different models....So, just a thought..
Maybe it would be worth considering ??

Martyn's right.....Doing wheels is a complete pain in the bum.....Unless you're a diva with a mini lathe.....Something that I'm most certainly not !
Just one of the reasons I just loathe doing vehicles. :P

Cheers - Phil.